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post #1 of 53 (permalink) Old 09-28-2005, 07:45 AM Thread Starter
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All Pro bumper (w/photo)

Anybody have the all-pro bumper for the tacoma:
THIS ONE

I'm having some issues installing....
Bumper rienforcement (factory) that is slip-fited into the frame and welded. It has to come out but it is also welded to another piece that holds the front of my skidplate. SOOO

I either have to cut the weld to the frame and remove everything (i.e. bumper rienforcment and crossbar that hold skid)

OR

I have to cut an entire box weld around the square tubing that holds the bumper onto the skid crosmember.

I'd ask all-pro but there is only one guy there who knows and everytime I call he either isn't there or I am on hold for far too long. I also thought that there was no cutting required to get this thing on!!!! WTF!!!???

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Last edited by mayhem; 10-03-2005 at 11:08 AM.
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post #2 of 53 (permalink) Old 09-28-2005, 08:51 AM
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Only one guy that knows what's going on and bad customer service from All Pro?!?!? No!! It couldnt be!

Didn't mean to jack the thread, but wanted to point out that little detail.
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post #3 of 53 (permalink) Old 09-28-2005, 09:05 AM
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Jon's had to do some re-organizing within his staff. I'd say it isn't a pretty thing. I'd call and ask to talk to Jon directly. He's using my truck next week to fab up a similar bumper to fit the '98 thru '00 Tacos. I found in the past that talking to Jon directly is the only way to get a straight answer... He's pretty busy though and in and out of the shop alot. I'll be talking to Jon today and I'll make mention of your issue and post back to you... Here's hoping he gets his staff issues sorted out soon...

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Originally Posted by Scootn2nature View Post
so fuck off you little 18 yr old lying ass punk.
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post #4 of 53 (permalink) Old 09-28-2005, 09:12 AM
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I spoke to Jon yesterday regarding your call, and he said there is an aluminum support behind the bumper that needs to be removed for the new bumper to be installed. He did not mention any cutting or removing any welded parts. The two of us on the phone do not own Tacoma's and have never personally installed that particular bumper, and since the question has not come up yet, would rather not guess at an answer, but find out and give you accurate information the first time. What year is the Tacoma you are trying to install the bumper on?
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post #5 of 53 (permalink) Old 09-28-2005, 09:15 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rockrawler
I spoke to Jon yesterday regarding your call, and he said there is an aluminum support behind the bumper that needs to be removed for the new bumper to be installed. He did not mention any cutting or removing any welded parts. The two of us on the phone do not own Tacoma's and have never personally installed that particular bumper, and since the question has not come up yet, would rather not guess at an answer, but find out and give you accurate information the first time. What year is the Tacoma you are trying to install the bumper on?

Sorry didn't mean to step on your toes... Just trying to be helpful...

Oh and can't you set your avatar to reflect that you're with All-Pro ?

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Originally Posted by Scootn2nature View Post
so fuck off you little 18 yr old lying ass punk.
'00 Taco SR5, xtrcab, V6, 5-SP, 4X, and some extras...

Truck...
~n~ ...off road action photo's
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Last edited by cbrRRman; 09-28-2005 at 09:21 AM.
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post #6 of 53 (permalink) Old 09-28-2005, 09:22 AM
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post #7 of 53 (permalink) Old 09-28-2005, 09:24 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rockrawler
I'm undercover... dont tell anyone...

LOL Sorry I blew your cover...

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Originally Posted by Scootn2nature View Post
so fuck off you little 18 yr old lying ass punk.
'00 Taco SR5, xtrcab, V6, 5-SP, 4X, and some extras...

Truck...
~n~ ...off road action photo's
Trailer...

Truck build --- Trailer build

Last edited by cbrRRman; 09-28-2005 at 09:35 AM.
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post #8 of 53 (permalink) Old 09-28-2005, 01:26 PM
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Rockrawler,

I would like to point out that the highly insulting and abrasive PM you sent me on this matter is a clear example of what I am talking about. You, as a member of All Pro Off-road, represent the company you work for and should do everything to make sure that name is protected... in the correct manner.

I had an issue a while ago regarding MarlinCrawler product that I ordered. After receiving some bad service, I posted on the board about my experience. After that post, a representative from Marlin was in touch and did exactly what was needed to make everything right, and me a happy customer. I HAD issues with MarlinCrawler. A rep took the time to notice I was not happy, and took the steps to identify what would make me happy.

Customers donít magically turn unhappy. Something has to happen. Everyone who works for an employer is a representative to the outside world and therefore should have the sense to try and amend those ill feelings about interaction with the company.

Why? Why would you PM me with that garbage? You could have easily made me into a willing or somewhat interested customer by simply addressing me with why my comment about All Pro was so bad.
-What could I do to make things better?
-Is there any issue I can help you with to change your mind?
-What can I do to make you a customer again?

Instead, you made a very poor decision to shoot-off a message that did nothing more than prove what has already been known. Representatives like yourself give All Pro Off-road a very, very, very bad name on the trails. Something really needs to change in the customer-service side of things at that location; it's more than just telling sexist jokes over the counter. You've got to be professional, not just act like it. You seem to have some years under your belt, and I'm sure you see the point I'm getting at. Even more, I'm sure you're a good guy in person and on the trails. I would, however, suggest a few deep breaths before approaching topics like this on the internet as I'm sure this won't be the last.

MarlinCrawler, Donahoe Racing, 4West, Demello-Offroad, Bentup, Kartek, Chris King w\ TRDParts4U. I have yet to hear of any issue they've had where it has not been fixed and all were happy with product AND service. As for now, I will NOT purchase any product for any of the 3 Toyotas in my garage from All Pro strictly because of the lack of customer service with others, nor will I recommend their business to anyone looking for product or service. As a matter of fact, I'll do a lot to steer prospective customers elsewhere because of their past record with Toyota owners. There are too many great businesses in California and surrounding area to have to deal with that kind of treatment.



I hope for the best that All Pro evolves and gets out of this really bad rut but for now, I see no change.

Last edited by Munssey; 09-28-2005 at 02:13 PM.
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post #9 of 53 (permalink) Old 09-28-2005, 03:49 PM
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Thanks for the heads up.....i'll definetly keep that in mind.

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post #10 of 53 (permalink) Old 09-28-2005, 03:52 PM
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I am not saying that All-Pro has everything together or didn't deserve what you said but maybe it was your smart comment that earned you the PM you received. i don't know you but it sures seems like you were fishing to start something with your post and you distinctively pointed out that you were trying to point out their flaw. At least they were taking the time to get the guy the right answer instead of telling him to cut something off of his truck.
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post #11 of 53 (permalink) Old 09-28-2005, 05:58 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Munssey
Rockrawler,
Why? Why would you PM me with that garbage? You could have easily made me into a willing or somewhat interested customer by simply addressing me with why my comment about All Pro was so bad.
-What could I do to make things better?
-Is there any issue I can help you with to change your mind?
-What can I do to make you a customer again?

Instead, you made a very poor decision to shoot-off a message that did nothing more than prove what has already been known. Representatives like yourself give All Pro Off-road a very, very, very bad name on the trails. Something really needs to change in the customer-service side of things at that location; it's more than just telling sexist jokes over the counter. You've got to be professional, not just act like it. You seem to have some years under your belt, and I'm sure you see the point I'm getting at. Even more, I'm sure you're a good guy in person and on the trails. I would, however, suggest a few deep breaths before approaching topics like this on the internet as I'm sure this won't be the last.

MarlinCrawler, Donahoe Racing, 4West, Demello-Offroad, Bentup, Kartek, Chris King w\ TRDParts4U. I have yet to hear of any issue they've had where it has not been fixed and all were happy with product AND service. As for now, I will NOT purchase any product for any of the 3 Toyotas in my garage from All Pro strictly because of the lack of customer service with others, nor will I recommend their business to anyone looking for product or service. As a matter of fact, I'll do a lot to steer prospective customers elsewhere because of their past record with Toyota owners. There are too many great businesses in California and surrounding area to have to deal with that kind of treatment.

I hope for the best that All Pro evolves and gets out of this really bad rut but for now, I see no change.
And here is a cut & paste of the actual message from me in the sent items folder of my PM box:
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rockrawler
No, you're way off base. Attempting to get the customer a correct answer when you dont know it is excellent customer service compared to guessing & telling the customer to cut off a welded part when it may not be necessary. Our bumper bolts on to 01-04 applications without cutting, it is very possible someone modified his truck before he bought it, or he actually has a 2000 model year which does require cutting. If you had a bad experience with All Pro in the past, the causes of those customer service related issues have been eliminated from our employ and are now working elsewhere. If you currently have a problem with our service and I will be happy to address it and help solve your problem.
Now instruct me on how I wasnt trying to be helpful, or address the problem.

When a customer has an issue with a part that I cannot answer, I refuse to guess at it, and possibly give the wrong answer, potentially creating more problems for the customer. The customer that started this thread had a question that had never come up to this point, and I wanted to get the correct fix not only for his issue, but for any customers in the future that may run it to the same problem. He called one day when Jon was out, and another day when he was caught on a long phone call. By the time I saw that he wasnt able to get to the call in a timely manner, he had hung up and I didnt have his name to look him up in the computer to call him back with an answer. He reached Jon today.
I agree that customers dont get unhappy overnight, and he had reason for concern, but that was handled. For you to come off with your comment was unwarranted. If you have a problem, Noah and I are more than happy to answer or resolve any issue if you give us a call.
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post #12 of 53 (permalink) Old 09-28-2005, 06:05 PM
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That was no where near the tone of your first PM and you PM'ed what is posted above to me well after I already suggested everything you followed up with.

So, all I really see out of this is that you agree with me and took my suggestions.. almost word for word. I appreciate the change in tone and promise it will get you much further with future prospective customers.
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post #13 of 53 (permalink) Old 09-28-2005, 08:53 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Munssey
That was no where near the tone of your first PM and you PM'ed what is posted above to me well after I already suggested everything you followed up with.

Well after? That would be true except for the time stamp on my 2nd PM to you was at 11:44 am, so I couldnt have "followed up" to one that was made nearly 45 minutes later at 12:26pm. I agree with your statements about taking care of customers who have had negative experiences with our company, and I offered to help you with any problems over 45 minutes before you decided to blow everything out of proportion in your 12:26pm post. I always try to make a situation right and keep things fair, but when people blast any company without having facts straight, I will defend that company, whether it be ours or the competitions.
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post #14 of 53 (permalink) Old 09-29-2005, 07:55 AM Thread Starter
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Damn guys, didn't realize what I was getting started.

Ok, so I got a call from John late in the day and was able to identify the fact that I missed 2 bolts because I was loosing light when I went to test fit the bumper. Still haven't had a chance to take them out but I will take all pro's word for it that the install will go off without an issue.

Would instructions been a good idea before selling these bumpers to people as ignorant as I am install them... probably. Should all-pros staff be as knowledgeble as John to avoid hunting him down or customer frustration... probably...

Will I order from all-pro again.... probably, it's a solid product and is very worthy. I just hope that the rest of the stuff comes with some sort of install guide.

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post #15 of 53 (permalink) Old 09-29-2005, 09:08 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mayhem
Should all-pros staff be as knowledgeble as John to avoid hunting him down or customer frustration... probably...
A suggestion for improvement straight from a customer. Let's see which road they choose to take.
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post #16 of 53 (permalink) Old 09-29-2005, 09:19 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mayhem
Damn guys, didn't realize what I was getting started.

Ok, so I got a call from John late in the day and was able to identify the fact that I missed 2 bolts because I was loosing light when I went to test fit the bumper. Still haven't had a chance to take them out but I will take all pro's word for it that the install will go off without an issue.

Would instructions been a good idea before selling these bumpers to people as ignorant as I am install them... probably. Should all-pros staff be as knowledgeble as John to avoid hunting him down or customer frustration... probably...

Will I order from all-pro again.... probably, it's a solid product and is very worthy. I just hope that the rest of the stuff comes with some sort of install guide.
I would love to be as knowledgable as Jon, and we are working toward that all the time. We will continue to address any issues that come our way and learn from each one encountered. We are also working on instructions for all of our products, concentrating on the ones with the most crucial details first. If you or anyone has any problems, please contact us so we can help.
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post #17 of 53 (permalink) Old 09-29-2005, 09:23 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mayhem
Damn guys, didn't realize what I was getting started.

Ok, so I got a call from John late in the day and was able to identify the fact that I missed 2 bolts because I was loosing light when I went to test fit the bumper. Still haven't had a chance to take them out but I will take all pro's word for it that the install will go off without an issue.

Would instructions been a good idea before selling these bumpers to people as ignorant as I am install them... probably. Should all-pros staff be as knowledgeble as John to avoid hunting him down or customer frustration... probably...

Will I order from all-pro again.... probably, it's a solid product and is very worthy. I just hope that the rest of the stuff comes with some sort of install guide.
Glad it worked out for you. I too think they make some solid products. And yes the staff sometimes is not in the know of certain products. The bumpers are fairly new to the staff and they may not be too involved with the R&D on them. But anytime I have gone to their place of business they have been nothing but sincere. Sometimes communication can be fouled by misunderstandings. And sometimes we rush to early judgement. But to badmouth a place of business before giving them the opportunity to resolve an issue is a bit unfair in my opinion... But when all else fails... speak to Jon directly...

Quote:
Originally Posted by Scootn2nature View Post
so fuck off you little 18 yr old lying ass punk.
'00 Taco SR5, xtrcab, V6, 5-SP, 4X, and some extras...

Truck...
~n~ ...off road action photo's
Trailer...

Truck build --- Trailer build
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post #18 of 53 (permalink) Old 09-29-2005, 09:51 AM Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cbrRRman
But to badmouth a place of business before giving them the opportunity to resolve an issue is a bit unfair in my opinion...
I wasn't badmouthing, it just was frustrating to get to the source of all of the info at all-pro. Maybe I am just impatient... But you get a toy like this and you want it on your baby as soon as possible...

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post #19 of 53 (permalink) Old 09-29-2005, 09:53 AM
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Only one guy that knows what's going on and bad customer service from All Pro?!?!? No!! It couldnt be!

Didn't mean to jack the thread, but wanted to point out that little detail.
I gotta agree with you. It took 4 pair, that's right 4 pair, of 5" lift springs to get it right on my 02 Taco. I was told to be patient and that they would get it fixed...2 months after I paid for the springs they got it right. Now, I will say that Sarah was great. Very nice and even refunded me the 70 dollar difference in the price I paid and the sale price they had a week later. She sent me a pair of greasable shackles as well but I told them that I was only being patient because I knew they would take care of me on some other parts down the road. Well, I called to tell her all was well with the last pair she sent me and when I made mention of them "taking care of me" on a new part she became rather defensive and was quick to point out that they "gave me a pair of shackles". We'll see what happens when I call and order a disc brake conversion. Here's hoping they really do "take care of me" since I spent, all total, about 10 hours in changing springs and replacing springs and going to the UPS store to return the defective one's.

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post #20 of 53 (permalink) Old 09-29-2005, 10:01 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mayhem
I wasn't badmouthing, it just was frustrating to get to the source of all of the info at all-pro. Maybe I am just impatient... But you get a toy like this and you want it on your baby as soon as possible...
I'm with you on that... When we put out the $ we want things to go without a glitch... But like I said it is a new product for them and they are still working out the bugs... You just happened to be one of the first buyers of the bumper... But hopefully your aggravation has made it better for other buyers in the future.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Scootn2nature View Post
so fuck off you little 18 yr old lying ass punk.
'00 Taco SR5, xtrcab, V6, 5-SP, 4X, and some extras...

Truck...
~n~ ...off road action photo's
Trailer...

Truck build --- Trailer build
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post #21 of 53 (permalink) Old 09-29-2005, 10:05 AM
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Quote:
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I gotta agree with you. It took 4 pair, that's right 4 pair, of 5" lift springs to get it right on my 02 Taco. I was told to be patient and that they would get it fixed...2 months after I paid for the springs they got it right. Now, I will say that Sarah was great. Very nice and even refunded me the 70 dollar difference in the price I paid and the sale price they had a week later. She sent me a pair of greasable shackles as well but I told them that I was only being patient because I knew they would take care of me on some other parts down the road. Well, I called to tell her all was well with the last pair she sent me and when I made mention of them "taking care of me" on a new part she became rather defensive and was quick to point out that they "gave me a pair of shackles". We'll see what happens when I call and order a disc brake conversion. Here's hoping they really do "take care of me" since I spent, all total, about 10 hours in changing springs and replacing springs and going to the UPS store to return the defective one's.
Getting the free shackles seems like consideration enough to me... But I'd talk to Jon if you plan to make more of it...

Quote:
Originally Posted by Scootn2nature View Post
so fuck off you little 18 yr old lying ass punk.
'00 Taco SR5, xtrcab, V6, 5-SP, 4X, and some extras...

Truck...
~n~ ...off road action photo's
Trailer...

Truck build --- Trailer build
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post #22 of 53 (permalink) Old 09-29-2005, 10:22 AM
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Now, I will say that Sarah was great.
In the last few weeks, I've ordered twice, both times from Sarah. I ordered new top mounts for my coilovers (heard they redesigned them and the newer ones eased install - I bought the lift used). Granted it would have been nice to get a larger discount (free shipping) but the parts I have are not defective. They work, just harder to install the coilovers, I've heard. I then ordered new rear Bilstein shocks. She beat Jackit.com's price that I presented her with when All-Pro's listed price was about $20 more shipped. To date, I've not had any issues.

Do you know why they call it "PMS"? Because "Mad Cow Disease" was taken.

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post #23 of 53 (permalink) Old 09-29-2005, 11:26 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mayhem
Damn guys, didn't realize what I was getting started.

Ok, so I got a call from John late in the day and was able to identify the fact that I missed 2 bolts because I was loosing light when I went to test fit the bumper. Still haven't had a chance to take them out but I will take all pro's word for it that the install will go off without an issue.

Would instructions been a good idea before selling these bumpers to people as ignorant as I am install them... probably. Should all-pros staff be as knowledgeble as John to avoid hunting him down or customer frustration... probably...

Will I order from all-pro again.... probably, it's a solid product and is very worthy. I just hope that the rest of the stuff comes with some sort of install guide.
Looking forward to seeing some pictures of it installed!

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post #24 of 53 (permalink) Old 09-29-2005, 11:48 AM Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by CYi5
Looking forward to seeing some pictures of it installed!
It's getting sprayed with Line-X right now.... I'll post begining of next week

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post #25 of 53 (permalink) Old 09-29-2005, 11:56 AM
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Originally Posted by mayhem
It's getting sprayed with Line-X right now.... I'll post begining of next week
SWEET! I love line-X, one of the best things i've done to my truck. Good choice

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post #26 of 53 (permalink) Old 09-29-2005, 12:38 PM Thread Starter
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SWEET! I love line-X, one of the best things i've done to my truck. Good choice
It's on my bed, yakima basket, sliders, bed cover, front bumper and soon to be on my compressor tanks for an Oasis system that I am setting up.

Unfortunatly it doesn't stay black. My truck is black as well so if this turns really gray I'm not going to be super happy....

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post #27 of 53 (permalink) Old 09-29-2005, 02:21 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 02tacotim
I gotta agree with you. It took 4 pair, that's right 4 pair, of 5" lift springs to get it right on my 02 Taco. I was told to be patient and that they would get it fixed...2 months after I paid for the springs they got it right. Now, I will say that Sarah was great. Very nice and even refunded me the 70 dollar difference in the price I paid and the sale price they had a week later. She sent me a pair of greasable shackles as well but I told them that I was only being patient because I knew they would take care of me on some other parts down the road. Well, I called to tell her all was well with the last pair she sent me and when I made mention of them "taking care of me" on a new part she became rather defensive and was quick to point out that they "gave me a pair of shackles". We'll see what happens when I call and order a disc brake conversion. Here's hoping they really do "take care of me" since I spent, all total, about 10 hours in changing springs and replacing springs and going to the UPS store to return the defective one's.
Oh crap, that what I just ordered to take care of my AP 3" springs premature failure! LOL. But I gotta say that Sarah has been great with helping get it resolved. In past I've had issue with them, but they seem to be doing a 180, and I just know to deal with her now when I have a problem.

FJ62 awaiting the build
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post #28 of 53 (permalink) Old 09-29-2005, 03:03 PM
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you always get the UV coating right? Now i'm even more anxious to see the bumper seeing as you have a black truck too.

1999 Toyota 4Runner Limited 4x4 E-Locked
Donahoe Extended Coilovers & Camburg UCA's ~
OME 891 & Icon Resi's ~ 285/75/16 Yokohama A/T-S
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post #29 of 53 (permalink) Old 09-29-2005, 03:55 PM
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You shouldn't have a prob now that I did all the prototype/test fitting for them. I realize it's not their fault but like the guy up higher said when you put out the cash you want it to go hassle free. Not to mention I live on the east coast so shipping times and cost are a hassle and having to drive a truck around with the ass end sagging and rear fender flares rubbing everytime I turn was gay. But as I said the manufacturer (not All Pro) had an issue during the process that lead to premature sag. All takne care of now and I am actually pretty pleased with my trucks stance now. Gotta finish welding the u-bolt flip then I'll take it out and beat it to see how the springs flex.

02 Tacoma V6 Dana 44 SAC, chromo's, BL 300M joints, full float rear, chromo's, disk's, ARB's F&R, PSC ram assist and a bunch of other stuff


Quote:
Originally Posted by FURACERMAN
I do this for a living, stacking lifts isn't that bad.
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post #30 of 53 (permalink) Old 09-29-2005, 04:03 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cbrRRman
I'm with you on that... When we put out the $ we want things to go without a glitch... But like I said it is a new product for them and they are still working out the bugs... You just happened to be one of the first buyers of the bumper... But hopefully your aggravation has made it better for other buyers in the future.
I bought a set of coilovers from allpro a year or so ago and had problems with them, they didnt fit right and didnt work right, no instructions, bad design. When I called allpro their attitude was "so, they work on our truck here what do you want?"

I was pissed that they sold me parts that didnt work right and didnt even seem to care in the least. So, I got some new coilovers that worked and vowed to never give them anymore of my business.

Since then Ive bought a rear bumper from allpro b/c it is nice and the price was right and im more than happy with it and the customer service was OK.

Allpro could sell alot of parts if they followed DR, DO, trdparts4u, SAW, etc's business philosophy, do what you can to make your customer happy. Are you going to get some idiots who want the world given to them? Yes, but you still have to be cool to them anyway b/c they are the customer, and the customer is always right (even when they are wrong).

1. Test products before you sell them to people and supply proper installation instructions ( instructions should be a no-brainer in our lawsuit happy society).

2. Do what you can to listen to, appease, and correct customer problems first and fire the asshats with the "look you idiot take it or leave it" attitudes.

3. Continue to build quality products with fair prices.

If allpro did this customers would find them, and they wouldnt have to advertise at all. For example, look at Donahoe. They've got a cult following for Christs sake! If Donahoe made DR toilet paper dudes on here would stand in line to buy it.

Personally I like to have choices when I buy things and hope allpro sees the light and suceeds.

Last edited by blackhawk223; 09-29-2005 at 04:11 PM.
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