All gutted and ready for a 3.4

[mrdoug]

Just a quick post about the progress on my 85. I pulled the tranny, motor, etc and will be cleaning up the monkey wiring, mounts, etc and getting ready to start my hunt for the new guts.

http://i252.photobucket.com/albums/hh40/MrDoug47/Junior%20Upgrades/IMG_1344.jpg

Hmm.. something's missing here, should be you able to see the rear diff from the front?
http://i252.photobucket.com/albums/hh40/MrDoug47/Junior%20Upgrades/IMG_1345.jpg

[mgoose82]

nice looking good

[Lysmachia]

Hmm.. something's missing here, should be you able to see the rear diff from the front?


Not from that angle.. LOL

Way to go Doug! We'll be happy to help however we can! Do you have a line on a 3.4?

[mrdoug]

No, not quite yet.. I'm setting a pace for the slowest build in history. Right now I'm watching my bank balance grow so I can get the motor, then wait till I can afford the ORS package, then on to a tranny, etc...

Since I can't afford the motor right away, I didn't bother shopping as whatever I find would be gone by the time I got the $$ together.

[vwfastg60]

let me know when your ready for the motor ;)

[SP!N4L T4P]

just wondering, since youre not in a hurry to finish this up, why not put in something crazy like a V8 or something with some really big power? or even go diesel...that would be cool

[ike]

He just pulled a 350 out.

[mrdoug]

let me know when your ready for the motor ;)

Why? you got a 3.4 with manual Tranny ECU and harness you're looking to get rid of?

[Lysmachia]

It;s too bad mine is auto, or I'd let you start with that while you hunt me down another one...

[mrdoug]

just wondering, since youre not in a hurry to finish this up, why not put in something crazy like a V8 or something with some really big power? or even go diesel...that would be cool

Heh.. it was crazy, but not really big power (potential, but the motor was stock from 81 pushing 165 hp tops, not sure about the torque). I'm not looking for big power, I'm looking for enough power. But adding in some gas milage and dependability as well.

It all sounds cool, till you have to move your core support out 3" and knock your firewall back 3" so you can make room for a radiator and fan, then deal with an engine bay that get's so hot the thing won't cool anyways. Not to mention the raping I'd be getting at the gas station when I went to fill it up.

I knocked the decision around for a few months and decided that big/cool was going to cost me $$ now and be a headache all down the line. Moving to the 3.4, dual cases, lockers, etc will make this what I want. And that's a rig I can drive to any trail (including Moab and eventually Cali), run the trail and make it back home.

[vwfastg60]

Why? you got a 3.4 with manual Tranny ECU and harness you're looking to get rid of?

No but i het a deal on the motors. The more we buy the better the deal and were looking for one or 2 more people to go in so we get them cheaper. So far we have 3.

[mrdoug]

No but i het a deal on the motors. The more we buy the better the deal and were looking for one or 2 more people to go in so we get them cheaper. So far we have 3.

PM sent

[Jacket]

Nice. You've got a hole in the floor so you can wheel it "Fred Flintstone style." That rig with a 3.4 powertrain will make for a perfect setup.

[mrdoug]

Actually I've always wanted windows in the floors. There is a military vehicle, a hemmit, that has windows down in the floor boards. I've considered replacing parts of my floorboards with 1/4" plexiglass.

http://thumb7.webshots.net/t/48/48/3/79/71/295737971kOiGSx_th.jpg (http://news.webshots.com/photo/1295737971060134007kOiGSx)

[RedRunnertc]

Actually, BajaTaco had video cameras under there ... would be sweet to be your own spotter!

[Lysmachia]

Diff camera's aren't too expensive. A lot of guys in Norcal have em...

[fondigley]

Looking good Doug. Can't wait to see you get an engine in there.

[Quick Draw]

So anything wrong with the 350? I would personally have a tough time pulling that baby out, after its already been converted...

[RedRunnertc]

The way the conversion was done, he would have to pull it out to fix everything anyways...

[mrdoug]

What TC said...

The 350 is fine, needs to be converted to TBI or TPI (IMHO) and the exhaust manifolds need replaced (stock manifolds have tubes, heat risers i think, that empty into the engine bay), but it was rebuilt 10k miles ago and runs like a champ. The problems were with the engine placement, too far forward, not enough room for a radiator and fan. The mounts look scary, even I could have done a better welding job.

Who ever did this, simply slapped in the 350, and didn't bother upgrading the tranny (which had lost it's syncro's) or any other part of the drive train.

oh, and it wasn't a simple decision, like I said, I've been knocking around the idea for a few months. I'd originally planned on keeping it and building up around it, but after a while, I can see nothing but problems down the road.

[ike]

http://www.ttora.com/forum/showthread.php?t=111296

[mrdoug]

Thanks for the heads up. Good deal, too bad it's in Bama.. shipping would kill me, but I'm checking anyways. Now to check my bank balance and see if I can even afford it, let alone the shipping and/or road trip to pick it up.

[TowerRigger]

Why? you got a 3.4 with manual Tranny ECU and harness you're looking to get rid of?

Why yes I do. Shoot me a timeline and some other thoughts. You know the 3.4 runs good. I spanked it but not terribly. The tranny needs gone through but it probably will last a long time the way it is. Just doesn't shift as smoothly as I'd like. Need the transfer case too? How bout a 4.11 rear axle with lunchbox? I haven't a clue what any of this is worth so I'll need to do some research. Gimme a PM if you're interested.

[mrdoug]

Hmm... that might be an option, we'll have to talk. I still have that nv4500 you were wanting too, maybe there some swap + $$ possibilities.

[ike]

so you cant make that tranny work with a 3.4?

[mrdoug]

Nah, the spline counts are all wrong. I looked for an adapter and couldn't find one (even from Advance Adapters). I'll be going with a R150f.

now I just need to get rid of the w56, nv4500 and the worn out g5x I got taking up space.

[thefatkid]

There was a r151 on craigslist, it costs more but would save the adapter.

[mrdoug]

I was thinking of the r151 at first, it has a great first gear, but most have complained about the gears being to far apart... and they cost more.

I thought the r150 bolted up to the 5vz.. what adapter are you talking about?

[poorboyota26]

If its' the $500 without the all important 23 spline transfer case I don't know if that would be a good deal. Isn't the transfer case the whole reason these things are soo expensive in the first place? Marlin installs and sells a conversion for the r150 that makes it just as strong as the 151 without the slow first gear.

[mrdoug]

In between work (clocked 30 hours on just sat and sunday this last weekend) and while missing the runs this last weekend, I found time to screw around in the garage...

I got to play with my new :saw: and cut off the old motor mounts and torque bar mounts

http://i252.photobucket.com/albums/hh40/MrDoug47/Junior%20Upgrades/Destruction/IMG_1348.jpg

When I was cutting the crappy 350 mounts off, I realized exactly how bad of a weld job they really were. Besides looking like boogers on the outside, there was next to no penetration of the welds themselves. Also I found holes in the frame from where they cut off the old 22r mounts. In these pix, you can see the old welds for the 22r mounts (I left the back marks for refrence points for when I put in the new 5vz mounts. They'll be ground down after I do my measurements/placing of the 5vz mounts), then you can see where the cutting torch or plasma cutter dug into the frame.
http://i252.photobucket.com/albums/hh40/MrDoug47/Junior%20Upgrades/Destruction/IMG_1364.jpg
http://i252.photobucket.com/albums/hh40/MrDoug47/Junior%20Upgrades/Destruction/IMG_1365.jpg

After that, I decided to yank out the seats to see what the floor boards really looked like, I found this rip in the drivers front seat mount
http://i252.photobucket.com/albums/hh40/MrDoug47/Junior%20Upgrades/Destruction/IMG_1359.jpg

And plates on both driver and passenger side right around where the rear seat mounts were
http://i252.photobucket.com/albums/hh40/MrDoug47/Junior%20Upgrades/Destruction/IMG_1358.jpg

I thought that was curious, so I pulled them up and found this:
http://i252.photobucket.com/albums/hh40/MrDoug47/Junior%20Upgrades/Destruction/IMG_1369.jpg

Along with the rotted front that I knew about already
http://i252.photobucket.com/albums/hh40/MrDoug47/Junior%20Upgrades/Destruction/IMG_1370.jpg

So I'll be replacing the whole driver side floor pan with 18ga sheet and figuring out what to do with the body mount in the front driver area
http://i252.photobucket.com/albums/hh40/MrDoug47/Junior%20Upgrades/Destruction/IMG_1361.jpg

[ike]

Doesnt really look that bad, but since your in there you might as well do it all.

[poorboyota26]

wow that's a lot more work then you bargained for eh guess it's good practice lol

[ike]

http://www.ttora.com/forum/showthread.php?t=116266

Another motor prospect for ya!

[mrdoug]

Thanks, but it's an auto and I wanted to go manual in this truck.

[ike]

Ah! I didnt even look at the for sale motor close enough to see. Next time i will have to look at the tranny configuration.

[poorboyota26]

hmm you need som cab patch pannels. I might be able to work some out of someone this weekend.

[ike]

I know doug and i both could use new floor pans.

[poorboyota26]

Here's Dougs new floor!
http://i250.photobucket.com/albums/gg253/KnAph0t0s/Salvaging%20parts%20off%204runner/IMG_1894.jpg

http://i250.photobucket.com/albums/gg253/KnAph0t0s/Salvaging%20parts%20off%204runner/IMG_1897.jpg

http://i250.photobucket.com/albums/gg253/KnAph0t0s/Salvaging%20parts%20off%204runner/IMG_1896.jpg

I had fun Doug thanks for letting me help.:D

[Gerdo]

Looks like a clean slate to raise the drivetrain and get a flat belly!

[poorboyota26]

nope it's going to the junk yard. :D

[mrdoug]

Yeah, thanks for thinking of me when you found that shell. Cutting that out was a bigger bitch than I would have thought. Thanks to Russ for letting us use the shop. I left a few cutting wheels and sawzall blades for 'rent'.

I'm still not sure how much of that I'm going to use in my ex-cab, but I got quite a bit of material to choose from.

[poorboyota26]

at least you wont be short and have to do it again. And we learned that a sawsall is the fastest tool for cutting metal. :D Gotta get me one of those things.

[00regcab]

at least you wont be short and have to do it again. And we learned that a sawsall is the fastest tool for cutting metal. :D Gotta get me one of those things.

I actually prefer cut off wheels on sheet metal, a much faster, smoother, cleaner cut.

But its good to see you guys got it out without too many issues.

Gerdo, that truck? running again?

:rofl:

The general statement of that (if you will) "truck" from the weekend, is "free might of been too much" :p

Its pretty thrashed

[RedRunnertc]

And we learned that a sawsall is the fastest tool for cutting metal. :D Gotta get me one of those things.

mmmmm plasma cutter mmmmmm

[poorboyota26]

ok ok you got me there but that means one would have to have an air compressor to keep up and a $1500 plasma cutter. I'll take the sawsall for $100. Russel has the compressor and the need for one though.

[RedRunnertc]

... or a good friend who isn't using it right now ...

[mrdoug]

You know, I'm actually a little affraid to use a good working plasma cutter as I'd just end up with another new (expensive) toy on the "gotta have" list.

We tried the 3" cutoff wheels on a die grinder thinking it would cut faster/easier than the sawzall (lots of tight spaces and corners), but we ended up with lots of places where the sheet was 3-4 layers thick and took forever compared to when we broke down and fired up the sawzall...

[Asha'man]

The general statement of that (if you will) "truck" from the weekend, is "free might of been too much" :p

Its pretty thrashed

What he said. :D That thing's life is OVER.

[poorboyota26]

took it to the scrap iron place today. only got 22 fing bucks for it. Oh well paid for gas I guess. Russel, Una, Brian, Doug, Dan and I all got some parts off of it. So I guess it turned out ok.

[thefatkid]

Yea, scrappin has gone to the pooper, less then $40 a ton now!

[poorboyota26]

It was


0.016 per pound F THAT!!

[ike]

buying steel on the other hand is alot less painful now though.

[poorboyota26]

a few of us should get to gether on that one. I'm broke though.

[ScottyC]

Ha. That was my "Ftoy" frame you guys just cut up. LOL

BTW, if you guys needing tubing, give me a call. I get pretty damn good pricing on tubing and steel, and I will extend that to you guys if you place a big enough order. Go in together and let me know.

[ike]

http://denver.craigslist.org/pts/950221608.html

Think you already found one, but just in case.

[TowerRigger]

Ya we have 2200 foot of aluminum waveguide we're gonna be scrapping. We were kinda wondering why the station was letting us scrap it. Still gonna be something like 6 grand but nothing like it woulda been a few months ago.

[ike]

That is sure to boost morale of the crew.

[mrdoug]

Just to keep making a little progress with getting the 85 back on the trail I started replacing the floor pan.

I started by prepping the section Poorboy helped me cut out from the Addicted leftovers:

http://i252.photobucket.com/albums/hh40/MrDoug47/Junior%20Upgrades/floor%20pan%20repair/11c7bfa3.jpg

http://i252.photobucket.com/albums/hh40/MrDoug47/Junior%20Upgrades/floor%20pan%20repair/60908933.jpg

We actually cut thru the rocker panels on the donor piece so that I could have the option of how to trim it down during this activity. I decided to take the approach of drilling out the spot welds and leaving the factory cut/formed sheet metal section intact. Mostly because I think it'll make a cleaner/simpler swap and I'm not in a hurry at all (basically filling time while saving $$ for the motor). This was fairly easy since it was off the truck and easy to flip around to get to all of them. It won't be nearly as easy to do the same to what's on the truck. But once all is said and done, I can puddle weld the new one in place and should end up with the same strength.

Here is the section I'll be putting in the 85.
http://i252.photobucket.com/albums/hh40/MrDoug47/Junior%20Upgrades/floor%20pan%20repair/a68e248d.jpg

these spot welds inside the body mount will be an extra special bitch while it's all still attached to a truck body.
http://i252.photobucket.com/albums/hh40/MrDoug47/Junior%20Upgrades/floor%20pan%20repair/d2dc9f0c.jpg

I had to remove quite a bit of the thick rubber-ish insulation/sound deadening stuff to find all the spot welds
Passenger side with insulation stuff still on:
http://i252.photobucket.com/albums/hh40/MrDoug47/Junior%20Upgrades/floor%20pan%20repair/b36d832e.jpg
Driver side with it removed:
http://i252.photobucket.com/albums/hh40/MrDoug47/Junior%20Upgrades/floor%20pan%20repair/ffa68a1b.jpg


Next was to chip away all the rest of the thick material (it's not really rubber, but definitely petroleum based material). I tried a few things including a semi agressive wire wheel on an angle grinder (which melted the stuff and made a huge mess while doing nothing to actually remove it). I found that a pry bar and rubber mallet worked best at chipping it up (using them like a chisel/mallet). This left me with a semi clean section to go in the truck (I took the wire wheel to the whole thing after these pix). After all is said and done it'll get a coat of hercu-liner inside, and rubber under-coating or POR or something on the bottom side.

http://i252.photobucket.com/albums/hh40/MrDoug47/Junior%20Upgrades/floor%20pan%20repair/dc96baa1.jpg

http://i252.photobucket.com/albums/hh40/MrDoug47/Junior%20Upgrades/floor%20pan%20repair/d4688b75.jpg

Next was to remove the dash and heater from the 85 and to start cleaning the existing floor pan to find all the spot welds. Thanks to AxleIke for the practice of removing the dash/heater on his runner the other weekend. We should time ourselves putting it back together to see who takes the longest and creates the most inventive curses:
http://i252.photobucket.com/albums/hh40/MrDoug47/Junior%20Upgrades/floor%20pan%20repair/06124ac9.jpg

This section is the main reason I'm doing this work. It's going to be difficult to weld up in there (top of driver side body mount under the clutch pedal) since the rust had spread a bit past where we cut out the donor section. The white line (seam sealer) basically marks the line where the new section will go. I wish I'd taken more time and a better approach to cutting up the donor section:
http://i252.photobucket.com/albums/hh40/MrDoug47/Junior%20Upgrades/floor%20pan%20repair/24fe2726.jpg

There's still some patching I'll have to do behind this section, but that's where the 4-runner flooring and the x-cab flooring differ too much for the donor material to be of any use.
http://i252.photobucket.com/albums/hh40/MrDoug47/Junior%20Upgrades/floor%20pan%20repair/2fc04cfe.jpg

My next step is to lift the cab up off the body mounts and start drilling out the spot welds on the truck. I need to remove the monkey 3" body lift anyways, so I'll remove all those and just rest the cab on 2x4's across the frame while I finish up the floor pan work, then order up new hardware and base body bushings (not lift blocks) from 4crawler.

[ike]

Looks like you are making good progress.

[poorboyota26]

If you set the floor pan outside for an evening it will feeze up and the rubber stuff will just chip off no sweat. I guess I spoke too late though. looking good though Doug.

[ike]

Everything you need

http://www.ttora.com/forum/showthread.php?t=121624

[Quick Draw]

Damn your floors are in WAY better shape than mine are.... But you're swapping over the whole pan? Why not just do a patch panel?

[ScottyC]

http://denver.craigslist.org/pts/986484448.html

[Lysmachia]

Oh man Doug, if you get your swap done before me I'm gonna be pissed! :neener:

I have everything except the wiring harnes. Oh and a full time job to pay for it (Though my Floral gig seems to be picking up!!!)

[Gerdo]

You gotta get on the ball Molly!

[mrdoug]

Damn your floors are in WAY better shape than mine are.... But you're swapping over the whole pan? Why not just do a patch panel?

I was going to do patch panels (multiple) but Kevin found that floor pan that was hard to pass up. I'm not in a hurry right now (waiting for $$ to breed and multiply) so I figured why not? I tell you it's a long, pain in the ass process. I'm mostly doing it just to see if I can do it and make it hard to tell the floor was patched at all.

There's still the spots where the last person attached the seats (multiple times) where the sheet metal is all ripped up. I'll still do patch panels back there. I meant to check out the work you did on yours, but forgot about it during that snow run.

Right now I have the cab suspended above the frame (sitting on 2x4's) and will wire wheel/paint the frame before I reattach it with new bushings/hardware from roger brown.

I should post the pix of the abortion of a body lift that I took off the cab.

[mrdoug]

Everything you need

http://www.ttora.com/forum/showthread.php?t=121624

http://denver.craigslist.org/pts/986484448.html

Damn, wish I had some cash right now. Christmas and some other good deals I ran across in Dec drained my reserves. I'm broke like a college kid right now.

But thanks for the links!

[mrdoug]

Oh man Doug, if you get your swap done before me I'm gonna be pissed! :neener:

I have everything except the wiring harnes. Oh and a full time job to pay for it (Though my Floral gig seems to be picking up!!!)

Don't worry Molly, at this rate, you might still beat me. The swap is only one part of what I got left to do on this.

As part of the swap, I'm going to go ahead and flat bottom the thing as well (mostly, probably won't relocate the gas tank till I flat bed it). I mean, why not, all new motor and mounts, new tranny (R151), new cases (dual 23-spline) that will involve custom cross member (looking to do something similar to AxleIke's). Then there's the front suspension, cross over steering, then gears/lockers... That is a long expensive road ahead.

My hope was to have it rolling by spring. At work we call that an overly aggressive schedule (which is code for "yeah right, in your dreams"). It could be done with enough money and free time. I got quite a bit of time, but not $$.. tho I just got a kick ass performance review yesterday, so I have to wait till April/May to find out what the bonus will look like.

[Lysmachia]

It sucks all this overtime you are doing at work isn't getting you PAID overtime.

My plan is to have tippy ready for spring. Whether we take her or Ron to Moab depends on if we get her done and we feel confident in driving her out. (No way in hell am I paying gas to drive 2 2nd gen gas hogs to Moab)

[mrdoug]

It sucks all this overtime you are doing at work isn't getting you PAID overtime.


eh.. different ways to look at that:
1) I was on the bubble for being reclassified to an hourly employee a few years ago. I figured it all out and getting paid hourly for my OT I would have lost about 5k per year.

2) I may not be getting paid per hour for my OT, but I'm still employed and they give me a nice check every couple weeks. Others that were reclassified from the above, were laid off (about 75% of them).

[Lysmachia]

Yeah having a job right now is pretty much the bomb...

Peeps are clamoring for a job even at Kohl's!

http://www.9news.com/money/article.aspx?storyid=107652&catid=75

[00regcab]

Progress is progress! looks good.

Theres a special trick to removing that "rubber based stuff" (aka: sound deadening). But it doesnt help you now that its off.

Drop some dry ice in on it, let it sit for about 20 min and smack it with a hammer. About 95% of it will come up, no problem.

[Gerdo]

As part of the swap, I'm going to go ahead and flat bottom the thing as well.

Oooooo. You get to cut up the fresh floor pan to tuck the trans/xfer up.

[mrdoug]

So I found some motivation and got the old floor pan out Friday Night, got everything prepped and the replacement in by sunday night. Just a note, this wasn't at all as easy as I'd imagined, but it still wasn't bad.

http://i252.photobucket.com/albums/hh40/MrDoug47/Junior%20Upgrades/floor%20pan%20repair/IMG_1734.jpg


Found a bit more rust behind the driver side body mount (between the rocker panel and the body mount bracket). Had to cut it out and replace with 16ga sheet. This part was MUCH easier than I thought it would be.

http://i252.photobucket.com/albums/hh40/MrDoug47/Junior%20Upgrades/floor%20pan%20repair/IMG_1738.jpg

http://i252.photobucket.com/albums/hh40/MrDoug47/Junior%20Upgrades/floor%20pan%20repair/IMG_1739.jpg

http://i252.photobucket.com/albums/hh40/MrDoug47/Junior%20Upgrades/floor%20pan%20repair/IMG_1754.jpg

http://i252.photobucket.com/albums/hh40/MrDoug47/Junior%20Upgrades/floor%20pan%20repair/IMG_1741.jpg

http://i252.photobucket.com/albums/hh40/MrDoug47/Junior%20Upgrades/floor%20pan%20repair/IMG_1742.jpg



The replacement section under the clutch pedal was a bit more challenging, I made up a do-it-yourself bender and used a hammer to form the replacement section. Compund bends using a vice and 'normal' tools sucks, but it ended up coming out ok. I miss metal shop...

http://i252.photobucket.com/albums/hh40/MrDoug47/Junior%20Upgrades/floor%20pan%20repair/IMG_1744.jpg

http://i252.photobucket.com/albums/hh40/MrDoug47/Junior%20Upgrades/floor%20pan%20repair/IMG_1746.jpg

The passenger side didn't match up enough and I ended up having to run a 1.5" strip of 16 ga. for the replacement pan to mate up to. I didn't get pix, and I didn't take my time, but it came out ok.

[mrdoug]

While I had the floor out, I took the opportunity to wire wheel the frame, and clean it up.. I put a quick coat of rust-tough primer on the tops of the frame before putting the new pan in. I'll go back and put POR-15 or equivalent before bolting the cab back down.

By Sunday night, I had the replacement pan in place and mostly welded in. I ran out of gas, so I'll have to get that filled before I can finish welding the upper body mounts to the cab.

I've never done rosette/puddle welds before. Let alone on old 20ga (I think) sheet metal, but I got the hang of it about half way thru. These welds are kind of embarrassing (not bad considering I taught myself to weld, but experienced welders will probably cringe), but they'll clean up and get seam sealer then bed liner so it shouldn't be too bad in the end.

http://i252.photobucket.com/albums/hh40/MrDoug47/Junior%20Upgrades/floor%20pan%20repair/IMG_1747.jpg

http://i252.photobucket.com/albums/hh40/MrDoug47/Junior%20Upgrades/floor%20pan%20repair/IMG_1749.jpg

While cleaning up, I realized that the rear body mounts in the cab seem to be missing the lip where a bolt/washer should go in thru the top... I need to take a look at what they should look like, then try to fix what I got.

Front pix from an 86 4-runner pan:
http://i252.photobucket.com/albums/hh40/MrDoug47/Junior%20Upgrades/floor%20pan%20repair/IMG_1760.jpg

Rear pix:
http://i252.photobucket.com/albums/hh40/MrDoug47/Junior%20Upgrades/floor%20pan%20repair/IMG_1756.jpg

[mrdoug]

I haven't figured out if the effort for my method for patching this is worth it or not. That front section is WAY more solid than it was, and I still have to cut out sections behind (where the rear seat mounts bolt down). The next sections I replace will be just sawzall/flat 16ga sheet welded in like most do, so I'll have a better comparison.

I plan on using 1/8" thick shallow c-channel under the sheet for bracing where the seats will bolt down. The c-channel section is about 3" wide and has about 1/4" lips to form the c... they are pretty stout and shouldn't be an issue.

I eventually want to put in either 4 or 5 point harness (pretty far down the list of things I need to do to this heap) but I'll figure out the mounting for that stuff later.

[ike]

Looks great man, all that frustration finally coming to fruition.

[mrdoug]

yeah, it feels good to start putting things together rather than tearing this apart (which is pretty much all I've done to this thing so far).

[Lysmachia]

Looks awesome Doug!

[poorboyota26]

WOW you really have done some work! looking good there Doug. I hope the bolt holes for the body mounts line up I didn't think about that until just now reading your post. They should though. The frame for an extended cab and 4 Runner were the same. (I Think?)

Either way GREAT job bud!

[mrdoug]

yeah, that's a concern.. I eyeballed them and they looked fine. I won't know for sure till it's time to drop the cab down on the frame.

For some reason, even as I'm typing that it sounds like a major oversight spelling disaster.

I'm sure it'll be fine tho.. the replacement section was a near identical match. Even the various hardline bracket mounts underneath lined back up.

[RedRunnertc]

No - 4Runner and standard cab are the same frame (103" wheelbase) - even then, not sure the body mounts are the same ... This might prove tricky ...

[mrdoug]

If I were replacing the whole cab (or trying to put a 4runner body on a ex-cab frame) it would be problematic to say the least... but this is one section of the floor of a 4-runner, which has the same dimensions, accessory mounting points, even the same ribbing in the same spots. As a matter of fact, almost all the spot welds were in the same spot. I'm 95% certain I'll be fine.

[ike]

I think all the trucks/runners used the same front pan. Then they changed the rear section depending on reg cab, ex cab and runner.

[poorboyota26]

At least you have the right tools to make it work. You could just move your body mounts on the frame if they don't.

[Quick Draw]

Lookin good get the body mounted yet?

[mrdoug]

Nah, that'll be a few weeks out still.. I need to order some new bushings from roger brown and fix the rear mounts. I'm nearly 100% certain that the rear cab mounts are fucked so I'll need to get some steel and weld it in place.

Also I'm going to paint the frame before I put the cab back down on it... taking advantage of the cab sitting on stacked 2x4's above the frame.

[AxleIke]

That looks AMAZING!!!! Great work!

I'm jealous. Getting me motivated to work on my floor now.

[mrdoug]

I got bored today and thought I'd start by putting the body down on the frame just to make sure everything was good.

The body mounts all line up :kewl:

The bed is still up on 3" blocks, but you can see how the cab will sit once finished. I don't have any bushings in there right now (cab is literally sitting on the body mounts).. Anybody have a rough idea as to how tall the stock body mount bushings are? I'm thinking 1/2" to 1" max.

http://i252.photobucket.com/albums/hh40/MrDoug47/Junior%20Upgrades/74a9b426.jpg

http://i252.photobucket.com/albums/hh40/MrDoug47/Junior%20Upgrades/fba8842e.jpg

[Quick Draw]

Damn...that fucker was tall before. Thank god you dropped that ghetto body lift.

BTW: Doris is gettin' paint this weekend!

[bloodyscrow]

Honestly call me a redneck.....but i like the look of that bed lifted higher than the cab.....looks kinda cool, your getting rid of those body lift blocks right?? lol im kinda serious haha

speaking of which, you should see how silly my truck looks right now, i took the ball joint spacers off of the front on my truck so that i could get fatkid's bracket lift...well i havent put the lift on yet so the truck sits silly low in the front and the back is all up in the air, looks like a goofy drag racer haha

[poorboyota26]

went over there yesterday to keep doug from making too much progress. I have to say he is rapidly becoming a master sheet metalist. lol "oh damn burned through it again" was used only a couple of times. Last time I welded sheet metal it was EVERY time.

GREAT ideas with the flooring Doug keep it up this thing is going to be one bad ass rig when you get done with it.

[mrdoug]

Damn...that fucker was tall before. Thank god you dropped that ghetto body lift.

yeah, it was ridiculously tall... made me feel like I was going to flop just taking a turn in my subdivision. I'll get a touch taller than this before I'm done. I still need to put in the body bushings (which I think is about an inch or so) and replace the front suspension (which might be another inch or so before the springs settle).


Honestly call me a redneck.....but i like the look of that bed lifted higher than the cab.....looks kinda cool, your getting rid of those body lift blocks right?? lol im kinda serious haha


Redneck... :)

Yeah, I'm ditching the body lift crap. Not that I'm against all body lifts, but 3" is pretty fucking tall, and these are aluminum and it was put together with redneck engineering, so combine all that and it was a nightmare waiting to happen.

went over there yesterday to keep doug from making too much progress. I have to say he is rapidly becoming a master sheet metalist. lol "oh damn bunde through it again" was used only a couple of times. Last time I welded sheet metal it was EVERY time.

GREAT ideas with the flooring Doug keep it up this thing is going to be one bad ass rig when you get done with it.

Haha.. yeah, I did get all the holes plugged up tho. That existing sheet metal was really worn out and seemed to burn thru if you looked at it wrong. Turned out pretty good tho. I'm doing the other side today and will post up pix later. thanks for the help yesterday!

[RedRunnertc]

I still need to put in the body bushings (which I think is about an inch or so) and replace the front suspension (which might be another inch or so before the springs settle).

Yeah, but there's NO drivetrain in it right now, right? Add several hundred pounds of engine, tranny, tcases and it will settle down a bit.

[mrdoug]

true... at least if the laws of gravity continue to apply to my garage.

I look forward to finding out.

[bloodyscrow]

sure looks good, much better than the last time i saw it, that was right after you got it back from scotty, so its been a while....but it does look better

[mrdoug]

Fresh from the trial/error department... One gently used 3" body lift.

Comes complete with rusted.. er... seasoned hardware of the lowest quality found in the spare nuts n' bolts box from the corner of the garage

http://i252.photobucket.com/albums/hh40/MrDoug47/Junior%20Upgrades/floor%20pan%20repair/405e4bd6.jpg

Self clearencing aluminum blocks

http://i252.photobucket.com/albums/hh40/MrDoug47/Junior%20Upgrades/floor%20pan%20repair/b4f13a68.jpg

http://i252.photobucket.com/albums/hh40/MrDoug47/Junior%20Upgrades/floor%20pan%20repair/2a204339.jpg

complete with highest quality bushings cut out of that old spare tire out back
http://i252.photobucket.com/albums/hh40/MrDoug47/Junior%20Upgrades/floor%20pan%20repair/a0fb6292.jpg

Act now and I'll throw in these heavy duty off-road enhanced body mount supports pre-seasoned to prevent problems with body mounts busting thru the sheet metal into your cab

http://i252.photobucket.com/albums/hh40/MrDoug47/Junior%20Upgrades/floor%20pan%20repair/9a0f5081.jpg

The price you ask?... I'll buy you a beer to never, ever, under any circumstances put this sort of thing on your truck if only for the sake of the poor son of a bitch who might buy it from you.

PS. Sorry for the blurry ass photo's, it's the best Bubba could take in his drunken stupor.

[Taco_Man]

Never mind.

[mrdoug]

So I've been busy replacing sheet metal. Here's the second section of the floor pan replaced. Yesterday I did the drivers side, tonight I finished up with the passenger side.

http://i252.photobucket.com/albums/hh40/MrDoug47/Junior%20Upgrades/floor%20pan%20repair/b57a603f.jpg

http://i252.photobucket.com/albums/hh40/MrDoug47/Junior%20Upgrades/floor%20pan%20repair/66f627c5.jpg

I came up with a kind of cool way to deal with the ribbing in the stock sheet metal by using a cut off wheel and slicing a notch level with the rest of the sheet metal, then sliding the replacement piece under the ribs but above the old stuff

http://i252.photobucket.com/albums/hh40/MrDoug47/Junior%20Upgrades/floor%20pan%20repair/fa503275.jpg

Welding this stuff was a bitch since you can only do 1-2" at a time to prevent warping. Turned out ok, but looks kind of hacked

http://i252.photobucket.com/albums/hh40/MrDoug47/Junior%20Upgrades/floor%20pan%20repair/b6516602.jpg

I had to deal with alot of the original sheet (20 ga. I think) burning thru, then having to patch over the resulting hole. Also had some problems getting it all to be flush with the new 16ga. Some spots I had to try to fill in about 1/8" gaps (which is fun when the original keeps burning thru).

http://i252.photobucket.com/albums/hh40/MrDoug47/Junior%20Upgrades/floor%20pan%20repair/0afbc439.jpg

some of the welds came out good
http://i252.photobucket.com/albums/hh40/MrDoug47/Junior%20Upgrades/floor%20pan%20repair/7ebedc2c.jpg

Others, not so much (as you can see). Once ground down, and then covered with bedliner, it shouldn't be noticeable. It won't win any beauty pagents, but will hold my fat ass off the ground, and that's what's important right?

[Quick Draw]

Wow, good work. Really, that's the best you can hope for when welding this kind of shit. You're a bigger man than me to post welds that were as difficult as that. Haha....notice that there are no pics of my patch panels welded in? Well....I still gotta work on mine...but there's a very good reason for that. Really I should have MIG welded them....but the challenge was cool. Really I should have had Maaco spray my truck with paint....but the challenge was cool.

[mrdoug]

eh.. I might take some shit for the welds.. it's fine tho.. I'm open for the criticism.. as long as it comes along with "turn the fuckin heat down" or "slow down" or something along those lines.

I've never really had any feedback on my welding. Poorboy came by and showed me how to run a bead once, I practiced (aka fucked around) for a few months. He was over yesterday and gave me some pointers. I've never really had any instruction, just read alot and burned a bit of steel. One of these days I'd like to take a class and get some instant feedback from a teacher of some sort.

[Quick Draw]

Well here's my "expert" (haha...) opinion:

Looks like you're not quite consistent with your speed and pattern. I see a good bead forming, and then a large void area, and then maybe another bead forming. If this is where you are restarting, you need to work on restarts. When you restart, begin on the old bead to melt it then quickly move forward, and rock the puddle back over the old one. If its not a restart, you're just skipping over that area too much. Lots of times I see people welding in big arcs and really over exaggerating their "C's" or "figure 8s" or whatever pattern they're doing, and that can cause welds looking kind of like yours. Its really a very fine motor control thing, like you're writing your name as small and as slowly as you can.

But again, I commend you. That stuff is not easy. On the other hand someday I might come to your place and show you how it's done on your machine with my floor boards...:D Haha...

[mrdoug]

I did have trouble with the restarts. The voids aren't as bad as the pix make them look, but it's not good. I tried starting on the last weld, then moving forward, but it seemed to just pile up on the last bead and not really smooth down.

Most of the bugger shit in those pix was from moving along, then burning a hole. I'd stop, let it cool, then go around the hole, and try to tie it in to the original weld with some bigger c's (sometimes resulting in another hole :banghead:) . There were so many spots where the sheet had been bent/straightened out/bent again, etc. By the time I came along to weld up to that, it just burned thru. In other spots, it felt like I was welding on 1/4" and could get a good bead and keep going with nice flat welds.

Doing this a bit more, I think I could really turn out some nice stuff.

[Quick Draw]

Yeah, honestly my description of restarts was more of a general welding one. If it was an Tig, Arc, or Ox/Fuel, I would do that. With a wire feed its a little different to make it look nice. You're better of forming a hot puddle right at the very end of the old bead, and then with a quick motion of your wrist backward, rock the puddle back. It takes some practice for sure. God knows restarts screw me over in test plates all the time...

One thing that I notice when I'm welding is that I think too much. If I focus on any one thing in particular it gets messed up. Even sometimes when I try to focus on everything. I'm not technically supposed to, but lots of times I throw my ipod in my ears, relax, and just weld. Your instincts will tell you how to form the puddle. Trust your eyes over your head. I'll let my head wander, completely distracted.....and magically I get a great looking weld. Honestly, I think that's why some not entirely intelligent people really excel at welding sometimes... On occasion I actually get into a mode of just watching myself weld without any input from my conscious mind. It's interesting because it's not entirely consistent but the puddle forms just beautifully based on my subconscious reactions. I know that sounds really weird, but hopefully some other people that weld quite frequently know what I'm talking about.

[ike]

Looks like the notching method worked out great for you.

[ike]

http://www.ttora.com/forum/showthread.php?p=1510787&posted=1#post1510787

[mrdoug]

Made a trip down to Jim's yesterday, came back with a clean front clip from an 86 pickup, a dash wiring harness from an 86 and a battery harness (including fuse block) from an 85 22R. I've already noticed that the connectors between the 86 dash and 85 battery harness have slightly different connectors, so I might need to make another trip down.

front clip
http://i252.photobucket.com/albums/hh40/MrDoug47/Junior%20Upgrades/front%20core%20support/IMG_1787.jpg

bucket o wiring
http://i252.photobucket.com/albums/hh40/MrDoug47/Junior%20Upgrades/wiring/IMG_1788.jpg

Now I just need to finish up the seat mount and rear body mounts so I can dive into replacing the core support and electrical.

The rear body mounts are challenging to say the least... not alot of room to work with the grinder, cutoff wheel and torch.

Driver side body mount
http://i252.photobucket.com/albums/hh40/MrDoug47/Junior%20Upgrades/rear%20bodymounts/IMG_1834.jpg
passenger side body mount
http://i252.photobucket.com/albums/hh40/MrDoug47/Junior%20Upgrades/rear%20bodymounts/IMG_1833.jpg

[AxleIke]

DUDE!!!

Awesome work on the floor!

How on earth are you getting the thing to burn at all without burning through???!?!?!!! All I can do with the Mig is punch holes. I turn it down, and all I get is barely an arc.

I need to come check this out and bring you your fan!

[mrdoug]

Thanks.. I've burned my share of holes as well.. I was just using .025 wire, low gas pressure, quick / short runs and some luck I guess.

I'm having a bitch of a time getting things dialed back in for the seat and seat belt supports on the underside tho.

[ScottyC]

DUDE!!!

Awesome work on the floor!

How on earth are you getting the thing to burn at all without burning through???!?!?!!! All I can do with the Mig is punch holes. I turn it down, and all I get is barely an arc.

I need to come check this out and bring you your fan!

When ever dealing with thin sheet metal, I try to stitch weld everything. It helps to keep it from burning through.

[AxleIke]

Thanks.. I've burned my share of holes as well.. I was just using .025 wire, low gas pressure, quick / short runs and some luck I guess.

I'm having a bitch of a time getting things dialed back in for the seat and seat belt supports on the underside tho.

When ever dealing with thin sheet metal, I try to stitch weld everything. It helps to keep it from burning through.

I'm burning through on tacks.

[Jacket]

Are you guys using 100% CO2 for the sheet metal, or a mix?

[RedRunnertc]

It will be even harder with pure CO2 - runs quite a bit hotter than mix and splatters more (unless you have Sean's Passport welder)

[AxleIke]

Matt, I'm running a Mix.

I'm going to try going to oxy/acetylene. You can make that lots cooler. Just takes forever.

I'd like it to go quicker, not slower, so I'm hoping Doug or Kyle has some tips!

[ScottyC]

Matt, I'm running a Mix.

I'm going to try going to oxy/acetylene. You can make that lots cooler. Just takes forever.

I'd like it to go quicker, not slower, so I'm hoping Doug or Kyle has some tips!

Turn your line speed up!

[mrdoug]

I'm running 75/25 turned down to under 20 cfm (Kevin helped me dial it in while I was welding that sheet above and I failed to write it down before it was changed, like 15 cfm if I remember right)... my lincoln 175+ has non-indexed speed/voltage selectors too, that allows me to dial in between steps which helps.

One thing I don't do with the thin stuff is weave back and forth.. most of the time (unless there's a hole or gap to fill) it's just straight line welding about 1" at a time, then moving 3-4 feet away to another spot. Rinse repeat..

Issac, if you want to swing by, I've got a bunch of spare sheet we can burn up.

[AxleIke]

Turn your line speed up!

Bear with me, as I need some schooling.

So, low voltage, higher line speed? I turned the line speed way down thinking that the speed was causing the burn through.

I appreciate the input. doug, sorry for the hijack!

[thefatkid]

Lower line speed forces more heat into the parent metals, higher line speed keeps a puddle growing taking most of the heat when on a lower setting. Also keep your gas flow down around 12cfm max

[mrdoug]

cfm.. not psi.. sorry, wrong terminology.. figured I was going to screw that up.

Good tips, I'm taking notes as well since evidently I have some learnin to do.

[Quick Draw]

Bear with me, as I need some schooling.

So, low voltage, higher line speed? I turned the line speed way down thinking that the speed was causing the burn through.

I appreciate the input. doug, sorry for the hijack!

The theory is that a higher line speed will lay down more metal, with the same amperage, therefore the puddle will be a little bit cooler. Think of it this way: Heat is your main variable that determines the quality of your weld, whether it has no penetration, or holes burned through. Now the heat of the puddle can be adjusted several ways to accomodate other variables such as torch speed and material thickness. In theory, you could have quite a high amperage and line speed if you hauled ass through the weld....but that rarely looks pretty, unless you're a machine. So you have to slow things down a bit in order to form a nice solid bead. In order to do this you have to lower your heat. You can do this with your amperage setting, yes...but also via your line speed, which with a higher setting will make the puddle grow faster, as Scotty said.

[Jacket]

We need a welding for dummies thread - for now, thanks Doug.:D

[mrdoug]

Happy I could oblige.. at least now there's some technical meat in this thread and not just my diary of crap I need to do.

[mrdoug]

Nothing like having the next mini-projects lined up to give you the motivation to finish up the existing mini-projects in flight.

I got the seat belt mounts reinforced and welded up along with the actual seat mounts. Also finished up the rear body mounts. I found that welding overhead is harder than I thought so it's not going to win any beauty contests, but is functional.

Seats in (imagine them with seat covers):
http://i252.photobucket.com/albums/hh40/MrDoug47/Junior%20Upgrades/floor%20pan%20repair/IMG_1872.jpg

I used 2"x1/8" strap under the seat mounts and 2"x1/8" shallow c-channel (1/4") under the seat belt mount. I'm planning on tying the driver and passenger seat belt mounts together with some more of the c-channel formed to the tranny tunnel later after I figure how far up I'll rotate the drivetrain and the associated tunnel hacking.
http://i252.photobucket.com/albums/hh40/MrDoug47/Junior%20Upgrades/floor%20pan%20repair/IMG_1874.jpg

http://i252.photobucket.com/albums/hh40/MrDoug47/Junior%20Upgrades/floor%20pan%20repair/IMG_1877.jpg

http://i252.photobucket.com/albums/hh40/MrDoug47/Junior%20Upgrades/floor%20pan%20repair/IMG_1878.jpg


The thought behind using different materials for the reinforcement is that in the event of a crash etc.. the seat mounts would see less force than the seat belt mounts. The stock design simply have some thicker sheet (not sure of the gauge) formed with ribs that goes across the width of the truck. The seat mounts and the seat belt mounts are bolted to this thru the floor pan sheet. I'm using thicker sheet than stock, but lacked the ribbing so figured some reinforcement was needed. I could have run the same shallow c-channel for both, but seemed like it wasn't needed. Also since the force is pulling up thru the floor pan, I didn't feel it was necessary to fully weld the reinforcements to the floor pan. It shouldn't be too hard to grind out the welds and rework it later if needed.

[mrdoug]

I also started labeling and pulling all the engine bay wiring out, and further clearing out the engine bay to prep for replacing the core support.

http://i252.photobucket.com/albums/hh40/MrDoug47/Junior%20Upgrades/front%20core%20support/IMG_1879.jpg

Currently I'm trying to decide where to cut the front clip. The front core support section where it butts up to the fenders is logical, but the passenger side is really corroded/rusted so I don;t think I'll be getting a good weld there. That leaves me with doing but welds with 20 ga. sheet which is no fun, but seems like the best option. Getting exact cuts so that there are no gaps for the butt welds is going to be tough too and that's what I'm considering when choosing where to cut.

My top candidates right now is about 2" behind the core support before the battery tray or near the top of the wheel well after the battery tray. I have nearly the full front clip to replace it with, but not the full thing (meaning I can't drill out the spot welds at the firewall and simply replace the full front clip).

[RedRunnertc]

I would try to flange it and have a lap joint instead of a butt weld.

[bluetaco]

F welding it... just use body panel adhesive and a good lap joint.
Save time and material... it is just as strong and won't be affected by existing rust!

[ike]

But wouldnt be nearly as nice or take as much time.

[mrdoug]

The flange idea is appealing, but I can't imagine how to flange the curves/bends etc (since most of the material I need to mate is not flat). Any fabricators out there that have actually done this with a preformed piece of sheet?

[packrat1]

The flange idea is appealing, but I can't imagine how to flange the curves/bends etc (since most of the material I need to mate is not flat). Any fabricators out there that have actually done this with a preformed piece of sheet?

I don't know if this will help, but I've been able to flange curves by first sniping into the curve in several places then flange in short sections. The metal will stretch easier done in bits like this because they will flange individually. The radius of the curve and the size (width) of the flange tool will determine how far apart you snip.

Im not sure if Im being clear.

[mrdoug]

I think I follow you. I've never seen a flange tool.. I'll have to hit google up later today.

[RedRunnertc]

There's a variety of flanging tools, the most common being like a pair of pliers with formed jaws to make the flange.

[packrat1]

There's a variety of flanging tools, the most common being like a pair of pliers with formed jaws to make the flange.

Yes, mine are a modified pair of vice grips. Basically some dies welded into the jaws.

[mrdoug]

So I found the flange tool online, just like you guys said, looks like a good way to go, but the tool is about $60. That's a bit more than I was hoping for considering I'm probably not going to use it much after this project. I thought I'd check around and see if anybody local (front range from loveland to denver area) has one they'd loan me?

[RedRunnertc]

You could tack some blocks into vice grip jaws like packrat did.

[mrdoug]

Well, it's been a while since I've updated this thread (figure I'd make it into a build thread, might ask to rename it later).

In April I ended up drilling the spot welds in the front and just pulling off the face and replacing that part. turned out the rust in the passenger front (stock battery tray area) wasn't that bad.

In the process of cutting out that front core support, I found that the inner wheel wells were barely hanging on to the firewall (driver side had 1 spot weld up top and one at the bottom and that was it), and the sides of the clip up near the firewall had a few good sized cracks in the sheet.

I went ahead and welded all that up and now that front clip feels more sturdy!

http://i252.photobucket.com/albums/hh40/MrDoug47/Junior%20Upgrades/front%20core%20support/IMG_1880.jpg

http://i252.photobucket.com/albums/hh40/MrDoug47/Junior%20Upgrades/front%20core%20support/IMG_1881.jpg

http://i252.photobucket.com/albums/hh40/MrDoug47/Junior%20Upgrades/front%20core%20support/IMG_1884.jpg


http://i252.photobucket.com/albums/hh40/MrDoug47/Junior%20Upgrades/front%20core%20support/IMG_1885.jpg

http://i252.photobucket.com/albums/hh40/MrDoug47/Junior%20Upgrades/front%20core%20support/IMG_1891.jpg

http://i252.photobucket.com/albums/hh40/MrDoug47/Junior%20Upgrades/front%20core%20support/IMG_1894.jpg

I decided on a 1" body lift to help with the drive train lift as well as all the new exhaust, brake and fuel lines. That's all bolted up now and I threw a coat of white paint in the engine bay (white just so that it will be easier to identify fluid leaks down the road).

[mrdoug]

In another thread I built up the dual ultimate cases 10* clocked (http://www.tacomaterritory.com/forum/showthread.php?t=134253) and that's sitting just waiting for another tranny output seal as I trashed the one marlin sends along with the kit during the first install attempt. Should be here in the next week or so I think.

I've also ordered up the FROR crossmember (10* clocked) and found that they are bundling the skids for only $60 more, so I went that route for the time being. I'm not a big fan of skid's that bolt up to that which they are protecting, so after I get the bugs worked out and see where the drive train is in relation to the frame, i'll look at a different/custom skid set that bolts to the frame and covers most of the underside. I've seen some ideas over on pirate that I'll steal when it comes time. (this one in particular http://www.pirate4x4.com/forum/showpost.php?p=7619743&postcount=16 )

[mrdoug]

This weekend I figured I'd dive into the radiator, shroud and fan. I've started by taking a queue from real fabricators and mock up in cardboard first.

I'm going to be using a radiator out of a 3.0 then building a custom shroud and using a ford taurus fan (electric 2 speed). The taurus fan is supposed to be one of the most powerful fans found in the junk yard. They are cheap and plentiful. The spec's on them are kind of all over the place, but the numbers I've seen the most say 49 amps at start, high setting 25-29 continuous. Low setting is 12-16 continuous pushing alot of CFM, unfortunately I've not found a solid number of CFM at each speed, but most agree it's a shitload. The most common application I've seen is for SBC conversions so I know it'll get the job done.

The plan is to wire the fan up to a switch in the cab inline with a termo switch so I have the options of off, on-auto, on-high. I've seen pleanty of complicated wiring diagrams i'll use down the road when I start that fun.

The fan is a little thick showing just under 5" (about 1 1/8" from the bottom of the mount to the bottom of the fan itself). I'm planning on making the shroud sit 1.5" off the fins of the rad with the shroud covering all the fin area and mounting to the sides of the rad where the stock shroud mounts.

First I had to fix up the radiator I picked up from Minerdude. The top driver side bracket had pulled away so I'm trying some JB weld to reattach. I also had to 're-round' the inlet/outlet's (used a socket and hammer, worked out pretty good, hope it doesn't leak)

http://i252.photobucket.com/albums/hh40/MrDoug47/Junior%20Upgrades/radiator%20and%20shroud/IMG_2048.jpg

http://i252.photobucket.com/albums/hh40/MrDoug47/Junior%20Upgrades/radiator%20and%20shroud/IMG_2050.jpg

I'm hoping I don't run into space issues in the engine bay. If so, I'll go to something skinner from the aftermarket.

http://i252.photobucket.com/albums/hh40/MrDoug47/Junior%20Upgrades/radiator%20and%20shroud/IMG_2046.jpg

http://i252.photobucket.com/albums/hh40/MrDoug47/Junior%20Upgrades/radiator%20and%20shroud/IMG_2043.jpg

http://i252.photobucket.com/albums/hh40/MrDoug47/Junior%20Upgrades/radiator%20and%20shroud/IMG_2052.jpg

I plan on using 18ga sheet with the hole cut out and using some small bolts to hold the thick plastic fan housing to it. Ignore the extra tears in the cardboard, it was an old piece that's been used for catching oil as well as melted slag from welding. the hole will be round and the bottom of the fan housing will be cut flush (my dremel blew up about 3" into cutting and I had to finish free handing a jig saw)

http://i252.photobucket.com/albums/hh40/MrDoug47/Junior%20Upgrades/radiator%20and%20shroud/IMG_2039.jpg

http://i252.photobucket.com/albums/hh40/MrDoug47/Junior%20Upgrades/radiator%20and%20shroud/IMG_2049.jpg

http://i252.photobucket.com/albums/hh40/MrDoug47/Junior%20Upgrades/radiator%20and%20shroud/IMG_2042.jpg

[poorboyota26]

:xrocker: Nice work Doug!!! I can't wait to see how the shroud turns out. :xrocker:

[ike]

X2

[gasbandit]

Not sure how you planned on controlling the fans but, if your going to use Taurus fans that use the integrated relay assembly(Constant control relay module) thats mounts on the upper radiator support grab a spare they were problematic.

[RedRunnertc]

Bring your sheet and cardboard template down while I have Pete's plasma cutter and we'll whip it out quick.

[mrdoug]

Thanks Troy, but I ended up using a stick, nail and marker to make the circle (17", well.. it was supposed to be 17" but think I got closer to 17.25" but close enough) and used a jigsaw with metal blade to cut the circle, worked really good too.

I'm pretty happy with the result. The raised section is just right, but the 'flanges' on the sides to run the bolts thru to the radiator for mounting was a little wide. No biggie, just need to trim it down.

I forgot to hit up Ace for hardware, so it'll have to stay mostly done till sometime this week.

http://i252.photobucket.com/albums/hh40/MrDoug47/Junior%20Upgrades/radiator%20and%20shroud/IMG_2056.jpg

http://i252.photobucket.com/albums/hh40/MrDoug47/Junior%20Upgrades/radiator%20and%20shroud/IMG_2054.jpg

http://i252.photobucket.com/albums/hh40/MrDoug47/Junior%20Upgrades/radiator%20and%20shroud/IMG_2053.jpg

I can't say how much easier/quicker this would have been if I'd had a proper brake setup instead of c-clamps, angle iron and a saw horse. But it'll work and I'm pleased with the results.

It turned out to be around 7.5-8" thick (depending on if you squint with your left eye or right) from front of radiator to back of fan. I'm affraid to go measure to see how thick the fan/shroud and fan are in a Taco, won't matter anyways (engine bays are different dimensions)... it'll just be one of those things I wonder about till I place the motor.

[ike]

Looks good.

[poorboyota26]

WOW great work man. Look how far you've come in just a year. The first time I came over to your house you were changing the tranny fluid on the taco and saying that was about the extent of your skills. Now your fabbing up fan shrouds, floorboards, engine bays and doing motor swaps. That's so awsome to see someone progressing like that. You are really doing A+ work man.

:xbeer1::clap:

[Lysmachia]

Doug that is awesome. Since you are putting in a 3.4 I bet you'll be ok on room. But in case you want to be pressed for room you can use ron's PITA 3.0! :D

[ike]

funny thing is the 3.0 and 3.4 use basically the same block.

[Lysmachia]

Yeah but for whatever reason it seems to be designed with more room. Don't know how!

[RedRunnertc]

The block takes up the same amount of space, but they got rid of almost all the other crap (vacuum lines, etc) under the hood.

[AxleIke]

Dude...Looks AWESOME!!!!!

[mrdoug]

http://i252.photobucket.com/albums/hh40/MrDoug47/Junior%20Upgrades/trany%20and%20t-case/IMG_2057.jpg

:D

Now if only marlin would send me my damn seals! Seriously... if you ever do business with Marlin, don't make the mistake of clicking on paypal option... while paypal authorizes your transaction in about 5 min, it takes Marlin over a week to acknowledge the payment and actually send you what you've paid for. I called them up after 2 days of waiting for a tracking number and they said it takes 'considerably longer because the accountant has to be notified'... that was last week. :(

Stuff ordered from FROR shipped the same day.

[Lysmachia]

Well it's well known that Marlin + Shipping = The Suck!

Which is so lame. They really need to get their shit together because they are becoming more well known for their shipping issues and delays than they are for their products!

[ike]

good thing you are not in a hurry.

[Mythica]

Well it’s been a few days since you picked up the hoist.

How come you don’t have the motor and tranny in yet? ;)

[mrdoug]

I was asking myself that last night. but then I looked down and had a beer in my hand and my ass on a chair and figured out the answer. :D

I'm debating skipping the triple by-pass and pulling the motor this weekend. and getting started on the cross-over pipe.

[00regcab]

Doug, contact Denny @ Brighton Radiator here in brighton. He does excellent work and is very reasonably priced!

Option 2 would be find OEM headers off of a pre 01 and use those.

Just throwing out some ideas

[mrdoug]

I might go that route (either of them). The donor has a double walled cross-over which means I can't do the fairly simple cut/flip/reweld. I've heard rumors about the flanges being different over the years as well which would mean I'd have to cut these flanges off and move them over (not too big a problem).

After doing some rough measurements, I'm only going to have about 1/2" to play with for clearance between fan and firewall. That makes me nervous about taking it to a shop to be done. But I know you're anal about these sorts of things, so if you say this guy is good, I'll consider giving him a shot.

[00regcab]

Just let him know the amount of room you have to work with when you talk to him. He'll work with you on it but would likely need the motor there for mock up, which would be the hardest thing to do on your end really.

[mrdoug]

Last weekend I got the 3.4 pulled (along with the drive shafts, tranny, exhaust, etc). I went ahead and pulled the A/C compressor off as I won't be running A/C. Once this thing is running, I'll be looking at hooking up the York compressor in it's place and setting it up for OBA.

http://i252.photobucket.com/albums/hh40/MrDoug47/Junior%20Upgrades/IMG_2069.jpg

I need to wait for a paycheck before I can order the oil pan stuff, timing belt (and other maint stuff), and the clutch. In the mean time, I've asked TheFatKid for some help with the crossover pipe. This came from an 03 ex cab and has the double wall pipe, which precludes me from doing the writeup on yota tech where you cut/flip.

I also need to figure out the clutch stuff. I'll be going with a 5vz fly wheel and pressure plate with a 3vz throw out bearing, clutch fork and clutch. Since I've never done a clutch before, I need to research the clutch options, as I understand there's a few different ways to go.

Also, I'll start looking at the wiring diagrams to decide if it's just plain easier to ask the FatKid to bail me out there as well.

[bloodyscrow]

sounds like JR is comming along, mine on the other hand is starting to make me wonder why the hell i bought a bent up truck... i cant even put a replacement fender on with out having to bend something lol

[RedRunnertc]

No A/C? Really? It's awful nice in Moab most of the year!

[ike]

I very rarely use the AC in the taco and then it is usually for Ace and not myself.

[00regcab]

Summer = A/C everywhere in the day.

didnt you originally plan for A/C for that 'just in case' type thing Doug?

[mrdoug]

I planned on keeping the A/C and seeing if I could make it work later. At this point, the A/C plumbing wasn't in the deal. I might spend the time/money to retro-fit later.

Right now the focus is getting it on the trail and start enjoying it. I've had this fucker over a year and have driven it less than 50 miles (and less than 100 yards of trail).

Basics.. motor, gears, axles, wheels rubber. What I touch, I try to do well. The bells/whistles will come later. I've used A/C once in the last 3 years, about 30 min on hells revenge and it was the first time my trany temp ever lit up on the Taco. I'll probably miss it on occasion, but it's not in my top 10 features of a truck.

[mrdoug]

So I got a bit bored standing out in the garage looking at the stuff and not really having anything to do on the truck, so I thought "what the hell, let's test fit it and see what all needs attention"...

First off, I didn't take the time to measure to make sure it was square.. this was simply a rough mock up and it served it's purpose. I know about how much room I have to work with.

The motor is sitting on the new ORS motor mounts, and firewall to cross over pipe is going to be the biggest bitch. The motor wasn't 100% squared, but eyeballing it, it was pretty close. I have about 1/2" on the driver side and a little more on the passenger side. I can probably finesse the firewall (sledge hammer) a little, but the close spot is right beneath the gas pedal, so 1) I can't knock it back too far, and 2) I'd be making room to run exhaust right under my foot. Stock clearance between the firewall and x-over pipe is around an inch so that's what I'm shooting for.

http://i252.photobucket.com/albums/hh40/MrDoug47/Junior%20Upgrades/motor%20placement/IMG_2074.jpg

http://i252.photobucket.com/albums/hh40/MrDoug47/Junior%20Upgrades/motor%20placement/IMG_2083.jpg

http://i252.photobucket.com/albums/hh40/MrDoug47/Junior%20Upgrades/motor%20placement/IMG_2076.jpg

http://i252.photobucket.com/albums/hh40/MrDoug47/Junior%20Upgrades/motor%20placement/IMG_2080.jpg

I also found that the stock x-over pipe actually hits the frame, so those suggestions to "just leave it and reroute everything else" are out.

http://i252.photobucket.com/albums/hh40/MrDoug47/Junior%20Upgrades/motor%20placement/IMG_2079.jpg

Luckily, the stock pipe kicks out around the starter, so when I switch it to the driver side, I can tuck it up closer to the block hopefully inside the frame. I really don't want to have to deal with headers and wrapping the exhuast under the truck.

Driveshaft shouldn't be a problem. Note that the orig 85 steering is still there (so I can move the damn thing around)... but there looks to be plenty of room to switch to the x-over steering.


http://i252.photobucket.com/albums/hh40/MrDoug47/Junior%20Upgrades/motor%20placement/IMG_2085.jpg

This little exercise also told me that the ford fan and my custom shroud were out (crap).. This is a bad pic, but there's about 1" overlap. I had a little room to play with the shroud depth, but not that much.
http://i252.photobucket.com/albums/hh40/MrDoug47/Junior%20Upgrades/motor%20placement/IMG_2075.jpg

I pulled the ford fan/shroud, and bolted up the stock 2003 fan and will probably run with this. I ended up with about 1.5" clearance between the fan and radiator. Stock clearance in my 02 is a little more than that, but should be fine. The ORS motor mounts have poly bushings, so the motor won't move that much, and I switchted to 4crawler poly body mount bushings. I don't expect things to move around too much, so the 1.5" clearance should be fine.

I'll have to work up a shroud for this setup. I also noticed that the fan sat to the passenger side of the radiator, which is odd. I know I didn't measure the motor placement, but the mounts sat pretty flush frame rail to frame rail so I'm confidant that i'm very close on the side to side placement, but the fan was off by a few inches:confused:
http://i252.photobucket.com/albums/hh40/MrDoug47/Junior%20Upgrades/motor%20placement/IMG_2089.jpg

http://i252.photobucket.com/albums/hh40/MrDoug47/Junior%20Upgrades/motor%20placement/IMG_2087.jpg

http://i252.photobucket.com/albums/hh40/MrDoug47/Junior%20Upgrades/motor%20placement/IMG_2088.jpg

During the WFTW run, I ran into RedChili (from Rising Sun) who did a 3.4 swap into an 86 I think... he also was running the r151 and noted how far forward the shifters would be. I had to roll mine under to check it out. This was even a worse fitup than the motor, my tranny jack won't go tall enough, but it was forward to where the bellhousing was against the block. Not too bad, a little trimming will be required, but I knew that already.

The strap is over the forward shift crawl box shifter hole, you can almost see the rear shifter mount
http://i252.photobucket.com/albums/hh40/MrDoug47/Junior%20Upgrades/motor%20placement/IMG_2091.jpg

http://i252.photobucket.com/albums/hh40/MrDoug47/Junior%20Upgrades/motor%20placement/IMG_2092.jpg

I might play with it a little tomorrow (I only spent a few hours on it tonight) and see if I can make sure the motor is square, and move it back a little.

I haven't heard back from Brian about help with the x-over pipe, so I might start seriously think about trying it myself. That should be fun.:rolleyes:

[ike]

Looks like you are making great progress.

[vwfastg60]

Wow your catching me!!!! Oh man i have to step it up...Off to the shop!!

[mrdoug]

Ha, not even close Russ.. I'm just doing mine in a different order than you are. I still have gears and suspension, and I haven't even started thinking about the wiring.

I played with it a little more today, got the motor pushed back more, but the stock (I think) shock towers are screwing with me (motor mounts current sit about half on the shock towers where they mount to the top of the frame).

I have it sitting in the truck now, with the hood on and fully latched. It's just barely touching the tubing on top of the intake. I think I'm going to be ok, with a couple of small spacers on the hood mounts without punching a hole in my hood. I'm sitting at around 18.75" from front cross member to the motor mounts on the frame. Currently the motor is lower on the passenger side, so I need to cut those towers off and play with the placement a little more while I figure out what I'm going to do with the x-over... the clearance is fairly tight, so I'm not sure how many attempts it would take me to get it right. I am leaning towards taking it to a muffler shop (probably the one Nate suggested), but I'm going to have to figure out how to document the clearance I need so that I can tell them and also check their work before taking it home and finding out their work doesn't work. I'll sit and have a few beers and contemplate it this week.

[vwfastg60]

If you are running a different tank and going to need to mount it why not say screw the Xover and just run the stocker and mount the muffler on the passenger side? You could put the tank on the drivers side or across the frame rails up higher. Fuel lines will be easier to move then deal with this Xover pipe.....atleast from the sounds of it.

[mrdoug]

If you are running a different tank and going to need to mount it why not say screw the Xover and just run the stocker and mount the muffler on the passenger side? You could put the tank on the drivers side or across the frame rails up higher. Fuel lines will be easier to move then deal with this Xover pipe.....atleast from the sounds of it.

because the stock x-over sits on the frame rail. It runs out over the starter/clutch slave on the passenger side (which would also make it interesting to run the hydro for the clutch slave)

[AxleIke]

Nice work Doug!

Looks like JR will be up and running for next season at least, if not for snow runs this winter!

Great job!

[mrdoug]

Just posting up a couple of pix to keep me motivated. T100 oil pan, dip stick and stuff should be here in the next day or 2..

Hood closes with 3.4 in with 1" BL
http://i252.photobucket.com/albums/hh40/MrDoug47/Junior%20Upgrades/motor%20placement/IMG_2095.jpg

http://i252.photobucket.com/albums/hh40/MrDoug47/Junior%20Upgrades/motor%20placement/IMG_2094.jpg

It's not level because the motor mounts are sitting on the shock towers
http://i252.photobucket.com/albums/hh40/MrDoug47/Junior%20Upgrades/motor%20placement/IMG_2100.jpg

I cut off the old shock towers yesterday, and found that the booger welds for them were actually hiding a ripped frame on the driver side. :banghead: Why actually plate a frame when you can just fill the holes with weld?
http://i252.photobucket.com/albums/hh40/MrDoug47/Junior%20Upgrades/motor%20placement/IMG_2113.jpg

So I'll have to plate the frame with some 3/16" before actually mounting the motor.

[AxleIke]

Ugh...That sucks man! Looks like you're making more progress though!

[poorboyota26]

HOLY CRAP!! someone stole your rims and tires and left Jr. on blocks. Shifty neighborhood Doug, very shifty. Maybe it was the batman up the street. :D

I love white engine bays. You are doing some fantastic work to a real basket case! Keep it up man!

[vwfastg60]

Looks good man! Pics are helping to motivate me too!

[mrdoug]

HOLY CRAP!! someone stole your rims and tires and left Jr. on blocks. Shifty neighborhood Doug, very shifty. Maybe it was the batman up the street. :D

I love white engine bays. You are doing some fantastic work to a real basket case! Keep it up man!

Ha ha.. yeah, it's the only way to get it low enough to get the motor over the core support. Take off the wheels and lower it down till I can just barely get the floor jack out from under the rear diff. Do the same for the front (except I jack it up from under the ubolts. And even then it's not low enough for my tranny jack to get that tranny all the way up. There will be some jerry rigging going on when it comes time to put the tranny in. I'm sure will cause wide spread panic about the saftey of small children and furry animals in the area.

[poorboyota26]

LOL that's funny. I have seen it done, where one lifts the transmission from the shifter holes with an engine hoist. It's a little tricky but works pretty well. One person on the ground to jockey the trany into place and one on the hoist lifting/lowering. The middle to rear shifter hole is about even balance point too, with the dual cases.

[Quick Draw]

Yeah to put my tranny in on Doris, I put her back on 31s, which still wasn't low enough, so I deflated them, and put all of my big tires in the bed. Then I used my motorcycle jack for the rear of the tranny and my biggest floor jack for the front. They both go pretty high, so it worked out. Otherwise there would have been no way. And Doris is even pretty short as far as most SFA trucks go.

[RedRunnertc]

Just get enough people to hold it up by hand until you get a couple of the bolts started.

I would definitely do the tranny first, then the tcases - depending on how precise you want to be with cutting the floor, the tcases will need to go in and out at least one extra time.

[mrdoug]

I've got it figured out and a plan to do it.. it's just not going to make the cover of OSHA monthly.

[00regcab]

Good progress Doug. I still owe you some time wrenching for helping with my cab swap and such, just shout if you need/want a hand with anything!

[mrdoug]

Quick update... I've got the block drilled for the new oil stick, realized I forgot to order the dipstick union (the part that sits in the block to accept the dipstick tube.

Here's the part numbers (they are also on other sites) for those that might stumble across this:


Dipstick - Toyota part number 15301-62060
Dipstick Guide - Toyota part number 11452-62060
Dipstick Guide O-ring - Toyota part number 96721-19010
Union (part that dipstick sits inside) - Toyota part number 90405-10033
t-100 Oil Pan - Toyota part number 12101-65030
Strainer - Toyota Part number 15104-62060
Strainer gasket - Toyota part number 15147-62020


Also, make a note not to give your local parts guy crap if he's usually cool. He wanted to know what truck I'm working on, I've been waiting for some parts guy to ask me this.. I told him 85 extra cab with the 5vz, he looked over his glasses at me without smiling, so I told him the motor came from a 2003 taco, he started typing, but then I told him this was to put the 2wd t100 oil pan on it, so use that instead.

He was not amused.

I've also got a 180* u-bend exhaust pipe on order so I can start cutting it up for my custom cross over pipe.

[RedRunnertc]

Also, make a note not to give your local parts guy crap if he's usually cool. He wanted to know what truck I'm working on, I've been waiting for some parts guy to ask me this.. I told him 85 extra cab with the 5vz, he looked over his glasses at me without smiling, so I told him the motor came from a 2003 taco, he started typing, but then I told him this was to put the 2wd t100 oil pan on it, so use that instead.

He was not amused.

Yeah, I usually use the "93 4Runner, but that ain't gonna help ya" line.

[mrdoug]

Ok, so exhaust x-over has me a bit stumped at the moment.

I have the 03 motor which has the double walled x-over pipe which is a slightly different design than the earlier ones (I think they switched around mid-02, but could be wrong). The Double walled ones have some sort of rigid insulation in-between the 2 walls that to have a charcoal type consistency.

The earlier ones had 2 pipes (from driver and passenger manifolds) come down to a special flange and on the 'cat side' of the flange collected into one pipe. This newer style collects the 2 sides before the flange. The strange part is the sizes and that's where I'm slightly stumped currently.

Here's some pix to help explain.

First the easy part.. the driver side is fairly simple, 2" OD pipe with a near 90* bend coming out of the manifold:
http://i252.photobucket.com/albums/hh40/MrDoug47/Junior%20Upgrades/x-over/IMG_2116.jpg
http://i252.photobucket.com/albums/hh40/MrDoug47/Junior%20Upgrades/x-over/IMG_2123.jpg

The passenger side doesn't even look like a real pipe on the outside, but inside is also 2" OD (oddly enough, the weld at flange is welded inside instead of outside, I'll use a 2" hole saw to remove).

http://i252.photobucket.com/albums/hh40/MrDoug47/Junior%20Upgrades/x-over/IMG_2115.jpg
http://i252.photobucket.com/albums/hh40/MrDoug47/Junior%20Upgrades/x-over/IMG_2129.jpg

You can see above that the driver side joins the passenger side and drop down to this flange, which is 2.75" ID (yes, I'm sure, measured a bunch of times both sober and drunk).

http://i252.photobucket.com/albums/hh40/MrDoug47/Junior%20Upgrades/x-over/IMG_2127.jpg

After this flange (before the cat) the pipe narrows down to about 2 3/8":
http://i252.photobucket.com/albums/hh40/MrDoug47/Junior%20Upgrades/x-over/IMG_2121.jpg
http://i252.photobucket.com/albums/hh40/MrDoug47/Junior%20Upgrades/x-over/IMG_2122.jpg

I've gone ahead and ordered some 2" 180* (4" radius) mandrel bent pipe sections from SpeedWay which I'll cut up for the manifold side. I'll be cutting off the existing flanges to be reused and that part shouldn't be much of an issue.

I'm stumped as to how to collect 2 2" pipes into a 2.75" pipe so that the existing flange down to the cat can be re-used. I've been considering the idea of throwing out these flanges and do something more custom for the drop down to the cat, but can't really find any 2 x 2" -> 2 3/8" collectors.

My next option is go find an exhaust shop to make something for me (but I'm resisting that as I want to do as much of this myself as I can), after that I'm thinking of having to find an older x-over pipe and cat section to cut up and use with this motor.

As for the double walled insulation part.. I'm not really concerned with it at this point. I'll be ceramic coating inside and out which has had some good reviews and possibly looking at custom heat shields if that isn't enough.

[RedRunnertc]

Dude - give up on trying to reuse ALL the parts and just come to the realization that you're gonna have to fab a custom exhaust. The only thing you need to keep are the flanges that bolt to the motor.

[ike]

looks like it is time to scrap the whole project.

[mrdoug]

Dude - give up on trying to reuse ALL the parts and just come to the realization that you're gonna have to fab a custom exhaust. The only thing you need to keep are the flanges that bolt to the motor.

Good point, not sure what I was thinking... guess I was making it harder than it really was.

[mrdoug]

Finally had a good day in the garage.. The inner frame rails are plated (3/6") and ready for the final fitting for motor and x-member mounts.
wow the lighting sucks for this one.. oh well.
http://i252.photobucket.com/albums/hh40/MrDoug47/Junior%20Upgrades/motor%20placement/IMG_2286.jpg

http://i252.photobucket.com/albums/hh40/MrDoug47/Junior%20Upgrades/motor%20placement/IMG_2287.jpg

Most of the welds are pretty good, the bottom side sucks but strong, there are no pix of those.

Next up is to get that flex joint ordered along with figuring out my clutch choice. I'll need some help here as I'm dumb about clutches, etc.
my combination is the 5vz, 3vz bell housing, R151 tranny.
I found some notes from a conversation I had with theFatKid, but don't recall if I have the right info here:
5vz fly wheel & pressure plate,
3vz throw out bearing, clutch

Not sure which pilot bearing I should use (I'd imagine it's matched to the motor side, but will research).

Then it's on to finding a gas tank (going to try a ford tank set up high above the frame rails directly over the rear axle.).

[colorado125]

Looking like things are coming along. And so you know, Ben is serious about wanting that 350 from you.

[00regcab]

Doug, I'm no expert here either, however I'd believe the clutch should be 100% 3.4 as the clutch is motor based, and not so much trans based.

I know the 5vz/3vz's are a little different over the 3rz's, however russ got a clutch for the 3rz to put in front of his r151 and it works fine. Yes, I know it works because we drove it tonight... thats right.

[mrdoug]

I've actually made some progress on the 85. Doesn't seem like much, but I'm pleased...

I reworked the mounts a bit and think I have the motor finally placed, all clearances look pretty good and the hood almost closes with no mods (I'll look closer later and see if cutting some supports and/or some spacers in the hinges can help, it'll actually close if I let the hood rub on the vacuum tubes)

Passenger MM
http://i252.photobucket.com/albums/hh40/MrDoug47/Junior%20Upgrades/motor%20placement/IMG_2305.jpg

Driver MM (Really hard to get a good pic here with the old steering stuff in the way)
http://i252.photobucket.com/albums/hh40/MrDoug47/Junior%20Upgrades/motor%20placement/IMG_2308.jpg

Pan/axle... I think I have about 6 or 8" here
http://i252.photobucket.com/albums/hh40/MrDoug47/Junior%20Upgrades/motor%20placement/IMG_2310.jpg

I haven't put in the cross over steering (IFS box) yet, but this is the clearance that screwed me last time and made me raise the motor up an inch
http://i252.photobucket.com/albums/hh40/MrDoug47/Junior%20Upgrades/motor%20placement/IMG_2312.jpg

Here's a side view
http://i252.photobucket.com/albums/hh40/MrDoug47/Junior%20Upgrades/motor%20placement/IMG_2314.jpg

I also got the tranny/tcase set (with the FROR xmember)
I wasn't going for full flat bottom, but I stuffed it up as high as I could without having to rework seat mounts, etc. This is the side shot where you can see the FROR skid that I'll run while I work out the rest of the kinks with the truck, then at a later time, I'll work on a better skid setup that hangs from the frame instead of botled to the cases

http://i252.photobucket.com/albums/hh40/MrDoug47/Junior%20Upgrades/trany%20and%20t-case/IMG_2316.jpg

I'm very happy with my tunnel rebuild, turned out nice. The shifters are pretty far forward, I might work on bending them down the road

http://i252.photobucket.com/albums/hh40/MrDoug47/Junior%20Upgrades/trany%20and%20t-case/IMG_2318.jpg

The shifters are in 3rd and front case in low.. this is as far forward as they go. If I tear apart the tranny shifter and bend it, then I can probably get one of those spots back for the CB or something else (I haven't even thought about a radio yet, but I do still have the glove box)

http://i252.photobucket.com/albums/hh40/MrDoug47/Junior%20Upgrades/trany%20and%20t-case/IMG_2317.jpg

I'm not quite done with the center yet, I'm thinking of fabing in some cup holders behind the second case shifter. I wanted to put my CB there, but I run the full size one and it doesn't quite fit between the seats the way I wanted.

http://i252.photobucket.com/albums/hh40/MrDoug47/Junior%20Upgrades/trany%20and%20t-case/IMG_2318.jpg