Just what 'makes' an expedition vehicle? [Archive]

pray4surf

01-03-2009, 09:53 AM

Nice of Shannon to add this section. But exactly 'what' makes a rig an expedition vehicle?

If we look at the definition of 'Expedition' (according to Mirriam-Webster (http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/expedition))

Main Entry: ex·pe·di·tion
Pronunciation: \ˌek-spə-ˈdi-shən\
Function: noun
Date: 15th century
1 a: a journey or excursion undertaken for a specific purpose b: the group of persons making such a journey
2: efficient promptness : speed
3: a sending or setting forth

I'm sure we all can agree on 1a; a journey or excursion undertaken for a specific purpose for the purpose of this discussion...

A purpose-built expedition vehicle should have:

1. Ability to carry more fuel than originally delivered from the dealer. Auxiliary fuel, be it an extended range fuel tank or on-board external fuel cans.
2. Self-sufficient - i.e. carries the basic needs of the occupants (along with basic vehicle repair items)
3. Extended range communication equipment
4. ???

What say you?

SprtnBit

01-03-2009, 10:08 AM

What about functioning as a recovery vehicle?

Bloo

01-03-2009, 11:12 AM

RedRunnertc

01-03-2009, 11:27 AM

Good question ... and a kinda pet peeve of mine. I agree with you, that you have to think about being DAYS away from civilization, not hours... Today, it seems that "I'm building an expedition style vehicle" is like the cool thing to say, when what they mean is "I'm turning my DD into an all-around weekend warrior". People seem to want to avoid the negative connotation implied by having a "jack of all trades, master of none" rig.

I think on-board cans are just the bare minimum. To TRULY be an expedition rig IMHO, you need a bigger tank - 500 mile range at least - and you should be able to cover that non-stop in a day, because the point is to get somewhere.

Long story short, it takes more than an ARB bumper and a snorkel IMHO.

TEJASYOTA

01-03-2009, 11:32 AM

Love that photo above ^^^^

What about functioning as a recovery vehicle?
Yes for it'self first.

To me a expedition vehicle also is capable to handle most environments and surfaces.
Able to protect the occupants from the elements.
Long range gas tank is also necessary. The current sub 300 we have on our Tacos is not enough.

devinsixtyseven

01-03-2009, 12:51 PM

We've had this discussion on ExPo a few times, always interesting to see what people think.

IMHO "expedition" is in the mind-set of the owner, and describes a use, not a set of equipment.

If you can go days, weeks, months or years at a time, comfortably, living out of your vehicle, over whatever roads you've chosen, without looking/smelling like a caveman, have a good time, experience things, learn things, then chances are you've an "expedition" mindset.

Expedition vehicles have been 2WD 70s vans, dual sport motos, Subarus, Honda Elements, and plenty of Toyotas...

...and yeah, long range fuel tanks, water, food, a decent camp setup, self sufficiency and self recovery, and sustainability...

But a fridge, jerrycans, snorkel and all that crap doesn't make anything an expedition vehicle. Only the owner can do that.

As far as expedition tech...IMHO that's things like your camp kit, "house" stuff like a fridge, shower, water source & possibly heater, backup fuel that's more than a bunch of jerrycans, comms, nav...all the things beyond big tires, flexy suspension, snorkels and winches, all the stuff that keeps you comfortable and clean and extends your range beyond a simple weekend trip.

How many of you know how to use a compass and a topo map to navigate?

-Sean

luni

01-03-2009, 12:52 PM

The simplest way to sum it up is time/distance between resupply. Which is largely terrain dependent. I'm not trying to make any excuses but African exped. vehicles can equip for as much as 1000 miles between stops while you suggest 500. All I'm saying is it varies. Someone in the Northeast won't have the dependence on on-board fuel like someone in the desert will.

Also comfort comes right down to personal preference. A lot of expedition minded people tend to lean in the direction of creature comforts simply because of the amount of time they spend living out of their vehicles but as Bloo graphically depicted, sometimes you don't have room for a RTT because your gunner has to stand there.

Basically my point is this thread is dangerously close to excluding people.

As ar as mindset goes it's spot on. Load up, roll out. Good bye civilization, see you in a week. Nothing beats waking up, starting a fire, unfolding the map, pointing to a mountain, and when you get there doing it all over again, meanwhile you don't see a sign anyone has been there in the last 100 years. Perfect.

ike

01-03-2009, 02:06 PM

Definately has to be set up to go out for several days and hunderds of miles without having issues of not seeing a gas station or a mechanic.

White Mountain Taco

01-03-2009, 02:55 PM

Sweet...an expedition forum. I'm a little disappointed at the guys who have a snorkel and seem to be calling there junk expedition worthy though. But I guess you have to start some where. I think there will be a lot we can all learn in here even if we don't intend to be out traveling for weeks at a time.

Hunt4Steve

01-03-2009, 03:15 PM

yes, any expedition vehicle should be able to carry its quoted occupants, as well as recovery gear, but the most important thing is redundancy in the most critical parts; drivetrain.

When I started building my 4Runner, I was all about the expedition stuff, then rock-crawling started to creep into my veins.

I setup the axles to be full-floaters, if one sections of an axle breaks, you're still gonna make it off the beaten path to a repair shop.
Spare tires and stuff to patch up the tires, plugs, patches, etc.
On-board air....yeah, it may be slower, but you have an infinite amount of air compared to a Co2 tank.
Place to store to 5 gallon cans of fuel
Hi-lift
Winch and Pull-pal for self recovery
Long range communication equipment
First-aid kit
super stout drive lines and spare u-joints
spare fluids, belts and plenty of tools.

These items will keep you going and get you to a shop if you need to, and will keep you going towards your destination.

87forunner

01-03-2009, 03:26 PM

Quoted from the Disscussion on Pirate:

i would say that an expedition is all about the mindset of the traveller.:idea:

4 or 5 years ago, my wife and i rented a uhaul in kentucky:dustin:(to pick up inheirited furniture for the in-laws from a recently passed loved one) and drove to san diego. we took as many route 66 sections that we possibly could.

that was an expedition. we took our time, stopped for pictures and went into the unknown.

if you have an adventurer/explorer mindset, travel to places YOU haven't been before, and try to stay off highways and away from big citeis:zzz:, to see the REAL countryside...its an expedition

it could be in a honda, it could be on a bike, it could be in a 4x4, it could be on your own two feet. in reality, there aren't many places in the U.S. that can't be travelled to/through, on a single tank of gas, without seeing a gas station. Mexico and canada are different with their large expanses of open spaces, and feel to me more like the classic "expedition" due to the lack of people and abundance of open space.

People get discouraged out of there explorer spirit because someone on the internet has already been there and taken pictures. I also see a lot of, "well you took a week to explore old mining camps in the desert", "been there done that....its not an expedition".

thats bullshit. It's your life, if you haven't seen it with your own two eyes, by all means, go and definitely call it an expedition.

my opinion.

here's the short list. if your trip has most of these its probably an expedition.

1. travel to a place you haven't been before

2. few to no people around to bother you

3. roads are simple, remote, unimproved or non-existant

4. carrying your own fuel, water, food, medicine, shelter is required

5. you have the mindset to "take it all in" and explore a new place

6. Human teamwork is required to logistically get the trip done due to
obstacles such as terrain, health hazards, distances, remoteness, etc.

I asked for this section to help get advice/tech on setting up my tacoma to have the ability to camp and travel well. I plan on taking a month long trip out west to Moab and California. While thats not as hardcore as some with their vehicles setup like Mogs and travel all over Africa. Eventually I would like to go down to Baja and just drive the Baja 1000 route.

On expo portal you see a large variety of vehicles from suzuki sx4s to isuzu troopers and Mitsu Monteros. While those vehicles aftermarket are probably very limited, they get the job done for the owners just fine.

Hunt4Steve

01-03-2009, 03:33 PM

I asked for this section to help get advice/tech on setting up my tacoma to have the ability to camp and travel well. I plan on taking a month long trip out west to Moab and California. ...... Eventually I would like to go down to Baja and just drive the Baja 1000 route......

I would suggest you take some spare half shafts with you. generally the rear end won't have issues, generally, but the front half-shafts are not very strong. Take some spare u-joints, fluids and recovery gear.....you should do great.

Bloo

01-03-2009, 03:45 PM

Agree with Luni and White Mountain - it means different things to different folks with different means. Luni hits the nail on the head with: "As ar as mindset goes it's spot on. Load up, roll out. Good bye civilization, see you in a week. Nothing beats waking up, starting a fire, unfolding the map, pointing to a mountain, and when you get there doing it all over again, meanwhile you don't see a sign anyone has been there in the last 100 years. Perfect."

Am I detecting snorkel envy?:D I enjoy this and other forums for the talent and ingenuity applied to building off-road vehicles. We select what we can afford based on how we intend to use our trucks based on the information presented here and I'm happy to see we have a thread now that shares this talent and experience. Day, week, month, year - who flippin' cares as long as we get out there and wheel. But I draw the line at on-board hot water and showers, though; that's not right...:rolleyes:

No judgements. We all share a common goal to respect and enjoy the oudoors, its challenges, and our rigs. Man hugs all around....:eek:

devinsixtyseven

01-03-2009, 04:44 PM

snorkel envy:lmao::lmao::lmao::lmao::lmao:

...OBTW luni I don't think "expedition" type stuff is exclusionary...not at all...part of the fun is the people.

I guess it could be self-exclusionary, in that a guy with a tip to tail build might decide that he's never gonna camp, ever...but nobody ever says "you don't have a snorkel, you can't come with us!" :rofl:

When you're planning a trip and inviting your buddies, all you need to do is spec how much 4WD vs 2WD vs highway mileage between fillups, how many days water and food, type of terrain, day/night temperature, accessory activities like hiking, climbing, kayaking, mtb etc. and required gear, and people who don't currently meet those requirements will either find a way to make it work (incl working with you & others in the group to distribute loads), or opt out.

I've carried fuel for smaller vehicles, everyone shares carrying the poo bag, we carry group water sometimes too...

I still don't have an RTT. Might never. Gonna have a fridge tho...and until recently my "expedition build" was a few tie-down brackets in the bed, and a good secure lashing system for all the crap we carry around LOL.

-Sean

Iggy

01-03-2009, 04:49 PM

I believe the truck should be built up to the point where you can cross terrain alone and avoid the nasty mud and of camber trails where your truck can be damaged. so more of a survival truck then anything else

Stealth 4x4

01-03-2009, 08:42 PM

You know, when I first heard of the ExPo from a TTORA guy on a run and started lurking the forums my initial thought was something like "A lot of these guys are using the term 'expedition' pretty loosely -- seemingly including a weekend camping trip to a campground with electricity, running water, and a gas station or convenience store within sight."

My wife and I had spent months abroad in foreign countries after taking months to learn a passable imitation of the language engaged in vehicle-dependent travel, camping out, hiking, pursuing our interests in wildlife and nature photography in remote areas, not seeing another person for days, etc... and the whole time never even thinking the word "expedition" even remotely applied to us. I spent a month in the cloud forests of Honduras with PhD scientists on a National Geographic funded study of jeweled scarab beetles that included hacking our way through dense jungles with machetes, camping out, washing in the rivers and sampling specimens to bring back to the University of Zamorano outside Tegucigalpa for further study, scientific description, publication -- the whole nine yards... and I still feel like I'm cheating a little calling it an "expedition."

The word "expedition" still brings to mind the early scientific expeditions and images of Wallace struggling in the jungles of South America traveling downriver to places never before mapped or recorded by western scientists in a dugout canoe (which we've sort of done in areas previously mapped and visited in the Amazon in Ecuador and loved by the way, but still didn't consider it an expedition at the time) and battling the elements with little but grit and determination to drive him onward while cataloging, making detailed line drawings and taking painstaking measurements and notes while collecting museum quality taxidermied and curated specimens of never before recorded species of wildlife, insects, plants, etc. And the whole thing began with a boat ride that took months with no guarantees of life or liberty along the way. Wallace... THAT was an expedition, I thought.

But since then I've come to realize that these forums really do have room for the guys running 1,000 miles for weeks unsupported by land rover in Africa, just as much as the guy who wants to take his girlfriend to the mountains hiking on a Saturday afternoon. I've had to adjust my definition of "expedition", now that I've seen how forum users online are using the term. If new lands are not being mapped, new species not being recorded, etc. it seems to fall short in some way. But that's just because I came of age reading about Darwin's finches and his travels in the Beagle, etc. Obviously I needed to broaden my definition. Now, how broad to make it is still a gray area.

So I guess all those extended vacations and camping trips we've been doing for years sort of qualify as expeditions in terms of the forums. I still don't tell my biologist colleagues that we've been on an "expedition" when we come back from Ecuador or Mexico or wherever. It's just a trip when I talk to them. But here online, it's an expedition.

For the forums, a road trip across the country with some camping in the mountains, deserts, lakes or wherever, 4-wheeling, hiking, or whatever you're into... is an expedition. Right?

tacoma_AL

01-03-2009, 09:31 PM

to me personally i think it is a vehicle that can take you off the beaten path legally, take you to a place were you can get away from it all and have fun and a good adventure. Wether it be fire service roads to rolling across the artic or jungles of SA. But really unless the person behind the wheel has a since of adventure and motivation, an expo truck with all the bells and whistles wont do you any good.

triplefive

01-03-2009, 10:47 PM

This is the Mayan Hunter it is owned by Vanderbilt universities archeological department. I know that there are certainly more capable rigs out there but i have seen this one in person and know that it is used. Its purpose is to explore rain forrest in Guatemala.
http://www.oramagazine.com/images/0504-apr/050401t-maya-hunter/10photo02.jpg

http://www.oramagazine.com/images/0504-apr/050401t-maya-hunter/10photo07.jpg

http://www.oramagazine.com/images/0504-apr/050401t-maya-hunter/10photo11.jpg

http://www.oramagazine.com/images/0501-jan/050101t-maya-hunter/07photo01.jpg

http://images.google.com/imgres?imgurl=http://www.oramagazine.com/images/0504-apr/050401t-maya-hunter/10photo02.jpg&imgrefurl=http://www.oramagazine.com/pastissues/0504-issue/050401t-maya-hunter.html&usg=__K4xtcsEin6VTseNOXyLB-38xnyI=&h=219&w=420&sz=33&hl=en&start=70&sig2=K8_ugJdxdZTAeSX05tLUtg&um=1&tbnid=Z257TH68rzLMrM:&tbnh=65&tbnw=125&ei=4DtgSYedE-GBtgensMGxDg&prev=/images%3Fq%3Dmayan%2Bhunter%26start%3D54%26ndsp%3D 18%26um%3D1%26hl%3Den%26client%3Dfirefox-a%26rls%3Dorg.mozilla:en-US:official%26hs%3DVuK%26sa%3DN

Ol' Scott

01-03-2009, 11:46 PM

I think everybody needs to read Stealth4x4's post and remember it whenever somebody feels the need to exclude others as not being "expedition" worthy. Here is somebody who could truly be exclusive but still respects that there is room for others to join who may not be just like them. :2cents:

devinsixtyseven

01-04-2009, 12:03 AM

I never been on an expedition...but I been on a lot of adventures...

alpha_nett

01-04-2009, 12:28 AM

:D "A purpose-built expedition vehicle should have:

1. Ability to carry more fuel than originally delivered from the dealer. Auxiliary fuel, be it an extended range fuel tank or on-board external fuel cans. CHECK
2. Self-sufficient - i.e. carries the basic needs of the occupants (along with basic vehicle repair items) CHECK
3. Extended range communication equipment CHECK
4. Pintle mounted M-240G and a metric butt-load of 7.62. CHECK"
http://i394.photobucket.com/albums/pp22/TangoBlue/toyotatacomav627ki.jpg

i dont mean to get stupid here, as i am completely opposed to all the retarded flaming to "rookie" comments, but that is an M240"Bravo" not a golf, so as to not misinform anyone. but it is of really no concern to wheelers. i could go on about driver and gunner names, and the circumstances to which BlackWater obtained '03 taco's, but again this is all useless info.

alpha_nett

01-04-2009, 12:42 AM

so i post something of importance here is my Expo 4runner
http://i29.photobucket.com/albums/c279/alpha_nett/trucks/Picture006.jpg
http://i29.photobucket.com/albums/c279/alpha_nett/trucks/Picture005.jpg
http://i29.photobucket.com/albums/c279/alpha_nett/trucks/relayinstall3.jpg
http://i29.photobucket.com/albums/c279/alpha_nett/trucks/fzj80springsemushockssonoranpanhard.jpg

87forunner

01-04-2009, 01:13 AM

I would suggest you take some spare half shafts with you. generally the rear end won't have issues, generally, but the front half-shafts are not very strong. Take some spare u-joints, fluids and recovery gear.....you should do great.

I know all about what breaks. Ive been wheeling my 4runner for the past couple of years beyond what it should be(for IFS). I wanted to get a TTORA expedition section because I like the way a lot of "milder" tacos are setup here.

Pirate you get too many "hardcore" guys that must wheel the hardest trails and then tow home.

Expo Portal you get a lot of clustered stuff. Like half the threads are about what tires rub or 4cyl vs. V6. And not a lot about general Tacoma tech and needs.

Here I think we will get a good balance of the two.

rigwelderstaco

01-04-2009, 03:53 AM

there are a number of good points here.

my :2cents:
i think that an expedition is in the mind of the traveler. doesnt have to do with distance, intervals between resupply, or the type of terrain traveled. if its somewhere youve never been before and its at least one night, then i believe that could fall under "expedition". not all of us out there, no matter how much we would like to, can afford to take weeks or months away from work and travel around north america, let alone africa, souther america or any other exotic places. for some of us, like me, getting a 3 day weekend means waiting until the next holiday. in the construction industry you dont ask for a lot of time off. if im lucky i might get the occasional monday or friday off, IF things are slow enough.

somday i would absolutely LOVE to be able to travel around the country, maybe one day go see africa, but until then im happy getting out to places like the mojave road and death valley. i dont go for any of the "extreme" offroadinng. im not a rock crawler or a desert racer, im more of an explorer. i like to get out and see the country, and old ghost towns, settlements, mines, etc. i like to prospect, hunt, fish, and just generally explore. whether its something new doesnt matter, as long as its new to ME.

that being said, i think an expedition vehicle is any vehicle that will get you where YOU want to go....and back again. for some thats a 2wd car. for others thats a purpose built land cruiser. for myself, my truck, while not perfect by any means, does what i want it to do. i have a lot of refinements in mind for my truck, but until i have the money to see them thru, its fine like it is.

for myself, i like the drivetrain to be fairly stock, heavily modified can also mean "hard to find parts", in a pinch. i like to build things so i built both of my own bumpers, the snorkel, and the light hoop. theyre made entirely out of scrap materials. and it doesnt matter to me one bit. they do the job that i want them to do. im not out to win any show truck contests, im out to explore. i carry the spares and the recovery gear that i think i need. i wheel easy and drive with a light foot.

i carry 15 gallons of extra gas, in cans, and i carry 11 gallons of water. my tent is an old coleman that i roll up with everything inside and strap to the back. nothing fancy, but it does the job. this picture sums everything up for me that an "expedition" should be. i wasnt far from civilization, about 30 minutes or so, but when i got out of the tent that morning i couldnt have asked for a better day to wake up to. sky was clear, weather was perfect, it was just one helluva day!!!
http://i295.photobucket.com/albums/mm136/rigwelderstaco/Mojave%20Rd%20%20%20Thanksgiving%2008/100_0760.jpg

i firmly believe that if YOU consider your trips expeditions, and your chosen vehicle an "expedition" vehicle, than it is. no matter what anyone else thinks.

"preacher switch - "off" " :D

SAR_Squid79

01-04-2009, 04:09 AM

...a road trip across the country with some camping in the mountains, deserts, lakes or wherever, 4-wheeling, hiking, or whatever you're into... is an expedition. Right?
YES!

And what makes on expedition vehicle? That's easy and very simple!
Only 5 things are needed:

Truck or SUV with a lift & oversized tires (4WD Optional)
1 spare tire stored ANYWHERE OTHER THAN THE STOCK LOCATION (Jeeps exempt from this rule)
1 Jerry Can (empty = OK)
1 Hi-Lift Jack
1 Roof Rack / Basket

SAR_Squid79

01-04-2009, 04:32 AM

Now that I got that out of my system... :neener:

Here's my :2cents:

In my mind, "Expedition" is all about the road less traveled. Being able to get to a place that most people don't know about, will never see, or COULD never access even if they knew about it. That's what I love. That's what motivates me.

I love the thrill, and mystique, and intrigue of going to a place that's off the beaten path, that nobody, or hardly anybody has ever been. The chance of finding something, or seeing something that nobody else has seen for years, in a place where the only foot prints and tire tracks are mine. Getting off "the grid", and getting away from civilization.

One of the biggest things I've learned from being in the Navy is that people are afraid of EVERYTHING. I know people in the Navy that are scared shitless of going camping. Just the idea of being outside of the percieved safety of their home, or ship, or whatever is too much. They are afraid of the wide-open spaces and the vulnerability of sleeping out in a tent. The last time I was in Utah I went camping in a place where the next nearest human being was probably over 20 miles away. I LOVED IT! And it's not for everyone, and I'm glad.

...Now - what makes an "Expedition Vehicle"? In my opinion an Expedition Vehicle is a vehicle that is extremely reliable, capable of negotiating rugged terrain, capable of recovering itself, and capable of covering long distances over land completely unsupported / self-sufficient.

In the strongest sense of the word, an expedition vehicle is PREPARED.

Signalprick

01-04-2009, 01:55 PM

i dont mean to get stupid here, as i am completely opposed to all the retarded flaming to "rookie" comments, but that is an M240"Bravo" not a golf, so as to not misinform anyone. but it is of really no concern to wheelers. i could go on about driver and gunner names, and the circumstances to which BlackWater obtained '03 taco's, but again this is all useless info.

So what kind of experience does Blackwater look for in it's operators?

Bloo

01-04-2009, 02:15 PM

So what kind of experience does Blackwater look for in it's operators?
Telling the difference between the bravo and golf versions of an MG is a must.:rolleyes: Ouch!

rigwelderstaco

01-04-2009, 02:29 PM

So what kind of experience does Blackwater look for in it's operators?

yeah i wonder if theyre hiring?? i need a job!!!

Signalprick

01-04-2009, 02:32 PM

Telling the difference between the bravo and golf versions of an MG is a must.:rolleyes: Ouch!

LOL:rolleyes: The 240 Gulf is the Marine Corps variation, No heat shields and lighter than the Army/Air Force 240 Bravo variation.....in a nutshell.;)

Mr Tacomi

01-04-2009, 02:37 PM

Expedition... well like has been said, means different things to different people.

My rig is obviously set up for the rocks, but I've kept it full body an will only add bars to prevent damage as things progress. I used to 'rock' a Samurai.. two things bugged me about the thing... short wheelbase, and no room for camping provisions.. so I changed to a vehicle that can climb steep inclines without affecting my ability to stay living, and had more space for camping gear that could comfortably sustain me for a week or more.

North America... well it's been traveled, and while I personally want to see several things with my own two eyes, I'm not going to build a '1000 mile rig' when I come across gas stations & towns within 300 miles of virtually anywhere I'd want to be going. Outside of North America... my finances don't seem to lend themselves towards shipping my vehicle somewhere to where an actual 'Expedition' would occur...so while those expeditions are on the back of my brain, my 'planning' of trips happens around the possible & probable locales of North America.

I'm still working on the suspension/drivetrain of the rig, but most of my work these days is around gear for being out and about for a week or more. Minimizing what I need to carry, vs what I want to have along. That's what I hope to learn from you guys, as well as share what I've learned!

Signalprick

01-04-2009, 02:37 PM

yeah i wonder if theyre hiring?? i need a job!!!
I don't necessarily need a job and my limited time as a Marine Corps SOTG operator coupled with my not having any real combat experience probably wouldn't land me one either....I was just curious

rigwelderstaco

01-04-2009, 02:42 PM

KamoKid

01-04-2009, 03:23 PM

I don't necessarily need a job and my limited time as a Marine Corps SOTG operator coupled with my not having any real combat experience probably wouldn't land me one either....I was just curious

yeah i was being sarcastic. i really do, very badly, need a job...but i doubt i have any experience that blackwater could use. unless they need a driver whos good with a gun...ill have to look somewhere else.

So as to keep this thread on track... IF either of you ARE serious, you can feel free to PM me. (No, i do NOT work for BW... YES, i DO work for another company that does protection work for US Diplomat's)

alpha_nett

01-04-2009, 03:43 PM

LOL:rolleyes: The 240 Gulf is the Marine Corps variation, No heat shields and lighter than the Army/Air Force 240 Bravo variation.....in a nutshell.;)

main visual difference between the B and G is the barrel.
Bravo: 49 inches in length, 27.6 lbs. <army
Golf: 47.5 inches in length, 24.2 lbs. <marines

alpha_nett

01-04-2009, 04:25 PM

I don't necessarily need a job and my limited time as a Marine Corps SOTG operator coupled with my not having any real combat experience probably wouldn't land me one either....I was just curious

the hardest part about joining blackwater is the physiological evaluation, given you met the requirements. after that you need some skills, combat experience would help, but knowing your way around a pair of nunchucks is the best way to get in.

Bloo

01-04-2009, 05:01 PM

Okay, here's the link to job postings for Blackwater...:xofftopic
http://www.blackwaterusa.com/jobs/default_contract.asp

Now back to the original topic, "Just what makes an expedition vehicle.":kewl:

Shelberford

01-05-2009, 01:08 AM

rigwelderstaco

01-05-2009, 02:00 AM

I own a 2006 Tundra Crew cab and I am considering more serious "unimproved road traveling and camping". I really like the truck and it is paid for, so I will make due with what I have. I don't have any big ideas of rock crawling or seeking out the hard trails, but just getting out there more. I am an avid Mountain biker and plan to keep the difficult stuff on the single track. I am also fairly well set up for camping at this point.

For all of you guys that are experienced in overland travel do you think I am nuts for wanting to do this with such a big truck? It is properly lifted to fit the 285's and nothing else has been done at this point. I will be honest and say I am not interested in trashing the truck. I have considered going farther with my build ideas 1. sliders 2. overland instruction 3. more recovery accessories: custom bumpers/winch 4. rear air locker 5. etc...etc.. That route will get me into spending anywhere from $5000 to $8000 more on the truck. A big truck with a crappy departure angle and huge turning radius.

Should I just stop while I am ahead and enjoy what I can do with it "as is" or take the next step? Would it make a good expedition vehicle for mild to medium duty?

I am all ears :D

i think it would be just fine. there are people over at ExPo that have trucks a HELLUVA lot bigger than a tundra, and they dont have any problems. over there, there are a couple of guys that use longbed, crewcab F350's, sportmobiles, and excursions. the only thing is youll just have to learn to accept pinstriping. thats just one of those things thats pretty much unavoidable, especially in a bigger truck. other than that, any damage is just up to you.

as far as mods go, just do what youre comfortable with. some stay mild and others go wild. for the kind of stuff you describe, stock may be fine. all depends on you and what you want to do. there are plenty of people out there with stock trucks, dont let anyone fool you into spending a bunch of money on stuff you dont need.

my suggestion, and ive seen it elsewhere in the forum, is to wheel the truck. as you get to know it better, and what it will do, youll learn what you need to modify, and how much you need to modify it.

TacoDell

01-05-2009, 04:11 AM

IMO... an expedition rig is a single vehicle that is self contained and self sufficient to supply to the needs of the driver and/or passengers of said rig for long periods away from civilization where there is little or no opportunity to replenish supplies...

Some need comfort... and others can get by with less

A basic list of importance to me...
(with any aspect of wheelin' IMO)

-A reliable, well maintained truck w/ Fr/Rr lockers (crawler box 'd be nice )
-Winch (front and rear if possible)
-Dual Battery (maybe another)
-Higher Amp Alt. (for the above)
-Off road and utility lights (hand held/control stuff too)
-Recovery Gear, straps, jacks etc. (dependant on terrain))
-Tools for truck repair (everything to rebuild yer junk)
-First aide (well supplied... NOT from walmart)
-Shelter (quality tent, truck bed w/shell, 3 sticks and a tarp)
-Food, water and storage (freeze dried shit and water... yep)
-Communication (Satellite, Ham, maybe you don't want to chat ?)

After the basics... it's comfort prescribed filler...

I'd think we'd need to keep load weight in consideration
All the above is already a considerable added weight...

I always thought of an expedition as ruffing things a little bit... down to the basics... keeping weight as low as possible but still having the supplies to sustain for extended periods... while actually wheeling yer junk off road for the most part

Maybe there's a poor mans expedition and a rich mans expedition ? :p

I saw a bum living in the dez once...
he looked to be living on a lifetime expedition... :D

terryj5

01-05-2009, 08:52 AM

The driver must have and use the correct size, mature, experienced and properly functioning BRAIN. Hardware means absolutely nothing (except at the mall) if the software does not work.
"A mans just got to know his limitations"

devinsixtyseven

01-05-2009, 05:37 PM

This is a Toyota offroad forum first and foremost, so it's easy to inject our usual viewpoint of drivetrain and suspension >> all else (or my favorite, wide tires equating to better performance), or the idea that you're gonna drive 1k miles to hit 3 miles of harsh offroad for two days straight and then go home.

The driver must have and use the correct size, mature, experienced and properly functioning BRAIN. Hardware means absolutely nothing (except at the mall) if the software does not work.
"A mans just got to know his limitations"

xEleventybillion.

Shelberford, the answer to your question deserves its own thread. Just take the answers you get, here at TTORA, with a grain of salt...you may not need every piece of gear everyone tells you to get. IIWY, a Scepter water jug and a nice camp kit would be near the top of the list, maybe a bike stand that fits in the receiver so you can do major repairs easily, maybe some suspension work to carry the heavy loads we usually see when we load up for a week in the backcountry.

Some concrete thoughts on what an "expedition" vehicle is...

-They have a tire size which fits under all conditions, that the steering system is able to handle, matched to the gears in high and low range, and which do not detract from the highway handling or trail capability.

-They use springs and shocks appropriate to their loaded condition, in a configuration which does not adversely affect handling in any situation.

-They carry a means for self-recovery in any terrain or weather condition, for the roads which they travel. This is not necessarily a winch, and might be different during the Ladoga Trophy than in Iceland.

-They have a thoroughly secured, easy to use, modular and scalable cargo system that does not adversely affect handling or weight distribution.

-They are safe, easily controlled, and smooth at highway or trail speed.

-"House" and "vehicle" systems are all smoothly integrated in to the vehicle, easy to use by someone who's never seen them before, and make good use of available space. Don't put all your shit on the roof because you think it looks cool, because if you do, your rig will handle like a fat chick chasing her last donut.

-The driver has a cool head and is more likely to think his/her way out of a jam rather than throttle out.

-The best expedition vehicle is a 1st-generation Toyota Tundra, because I have one :flipoff4:. At least that is what everyone will say about their vehicle of choice, which really means your expedition vehicle is what you decide works best for you, on the roads you wanna travel, even if it's not a 1st-gen Toyota Tundra.

And what they are not, necessarily...

-They do not necessarily have a snorkel, winch, lockers, crawl box, antenna farm, aux lighting, aftermarket bumpers, Can-Back, sliders, rooftop tent, refrigerator, big tires, air compressor, GPS unit, HAM radio, tall tires, wide tires, tall & wide tires, or laptop.

-They do not necessarily have a ton of "Lawrence of Fucking Arabia" shit loaded on the roof--shovel, hilift, spare tire, water, fuel, recovery ladders, ax, saw, chainsaw, fleshlight, tent, bedding, canoe, mountain bike, spare sheep, extra Seafoam, kitchen sink, etc (see "Cargo System" and "Fat Chick/Donut rule" above :rolleyes:). Seriously, if you're gonna carry a spare sheep, lash it to the load over the bed, like the guys on the archaeological expedition in Libya in the latest Overland Journal :flipoff4:.

-Sean

Bloo

01-05-2009, 08:35 PM

This is a Toyota offroad forum first and foremost, so it's easy to inject our usual viewpoint of drivetrain and suspension >> all else (or my favorite, wide tires equating to better performance), or the idea that you're gonna drive 1k miles to hit 3 miles of harsh offroad for two days straight and then go home.

xEleventybillion.

Shelberford, the answer to your question deserves its own thread. Just take the answers you get, here at TTORA, with a grain of salt...you may not need every piece of gear everyone tells you to get. IIWY, a Scepter water jug and a nice camp kit would be near the top of the list, maybe a bike stand that fits in the receiver so you can do major repairs easily, maybe some suspension work to carry the heavy loads we usually see when we load up for a week in the backcountry.

Some concrete thoughts on what an "expedition" vehicle is...

-They have a tire size which fits under all conditions, that the steering system is able to handle, matched to the gears in high and low range, and which do not detract from the highway handling or trail capability.

-They use springs and shocks appropriate to their loaded condition, in a configuration which does not adversely affect handling in any situation.

-They carry a means for self-recovery in any terrain or weather condition, for the roads which they travel. This is not necessarily a winch, and might be different during the Ladoga Trophy than in Iceland.

-They have a thoroughly secured, easy to use, modular and scalable cargo system that does not adversely affect handling or weight distribution.

-They are safe, easily controlled, and smooth at highway or trail speed.

-"House" and "vehicle" systems are all smoothly integrated in to the vehicle, easy to use by someone who's never seen them before, and make good use of available space. Don't put all your shit on the roof because you think it looks cool, because if you do, your rig will handle like a fat chick chasing her last donut.

-The driver has a cool head and is more likely to think his/her way out of a jam rather than throttle out.

-The best expedition vehicle is a 1st-generation Toyota Tundra, because I have one :flipoff4:. At least that is what everyone will say about their vehicle of choice, which really means your expedition vehicle is what you decide works best for you, on the roads you wanna travel, even if it's not a 1st-gen Toyota Tundra.

And what they are not, necessarily...

-They do not necessarily have a snorkel, winch, lockers, crawl box, antenna farm, aux lighting, aftermarket bumpers, Can-Back, sliders, rooftop tent, refrigerator, big tires, air compressor, GPS unit, HAM radio, tall tires, wide tires, tall & wide tires, or laptop.

-They do not necessarily have a ton of "Lawrence of Fucking Arabia" shit loaded on the roof--shovel, hilift, spare tire, water, fuel, recovery ladders, ax, saw, chainsaw, fleshlight, tent, bedding, canoe, mountain bike, spare sheep, extra Seafoam, kitchen sink, etc (see "Cargo System" and "Fat Chick/Donut rule" above :rolleyes:). Seriously, if you're gonna carry a spare sheep, lash it to the load over the bed, like the guys on the archaeological expedition in Libya in the latest Overland Journal :flipoff4:.

-Sean
:rofl:LMAO! x10:lmao:

But does it mean they could be expeditionary if they had all that Larry of Arabia shit?

I wonder what size quickfist mount would hold my fleshlight securely off-road?

You can't make this shit up!:rofl:

devinsixtyseven

01-05-2009, 09:08 PM

:rofl:LMAO! x10:lmao:

But does it mean they could be expeditionary if they had all that Larry of Arabia shit?

I wonder what size quickfist mount would hold my fleshlight securely off-road?

You can't make this shit up!:rofl::rofl::rofl::rofl: Larry of Arabia...that's gonna have to be an annual award, to whoever has the most shit on their roof all year :rofl:

Use the "medium" size. Gives a whole new meaning to "quick fist". :rofl:

Bloo

01-05-2009, 09:14 PM

I think I just pissed myself...:lmao:

Medium quickfist -- 3 inches of pleasure....:bhump:

devinsixtyseven

01-05-2009, 10:40 PM

Dude...you just gave me a great idea for the next part of my seat writeup :lmao:

Fleshlight Hardmount (http://www.ttora.com/forum/showthread.php?t=120865)

Jacket

01-05-2009, 11:48 PM

rigwelderstaco

01-05-2009, 11:59 PM

You guys are too focused on the snorkel. People who really know something know that a true Expo rig needs nothing more than an Engel 45. :rolleyes::p;)

Actually, I think it has to do with the driver as much as the rig. A stock truck is more than capable of being an Expo rig.

very true. i can take my truck all kinds of places without the shit i have on it. i just choose to carry the stuff because i would rather have it and not need it then need it and not have it. besides MR. MURPHY is a close family friend.:rolleyes:.

dyogim

01-06-2009, 01:49 PM

Being a newb on this expedition stuff, it seems that calling your rig (whatever rig it may be) an "expedition rig" boils down to one word, self-sufficient. Well two words hyphenated. :rolleyes:

A rig has to be self-sufficient in what ever environment they encounter. It's up to the owner/driver to be prepared with supplies and gear for that environment.

Shelberford

01-07-2009, 06:26 PM

Shelberford, the answer to your question deserves its own thread. Just take the answers you get, here at TTORA, with a grain of salt...you may not need every piece of gear everyone tells you to get. IIWY, a Scepter water jug and a nice camp kit would be near the top of the list, maybe a bike stand that fits in the receiver so you can do major repairs easily, maybe some suspension work to carry the heavy loads we usually see when we load up for a week in the backcountry.

Some concrete thoughts on what an "expedition" vehicle is...

-The best expedition vehicle is a 1st-generation Toyota Tundra, because I have one :flipoff4:. At least that is what everyone will say about their vehicle of choice, which really means your expedition vehicle is what you decide works best for you, on the roads you wanna travel, even if it's not a 1st-gen Toyota Tundra.

-Sean

Thanks, but I have figured out I don't need my own thread. This thread and reference to Overland Portal has helped me decide I don't need to buy a bunch of expensive stuff. A quote from Mr. Eastwood says it all: "Adapt and overcome".

I just need a full size spare tire (for the stock location). A pulaski and a collapseable bow saw. A couple of ECS Loadmaster boxes for organization and a Woobie to keep my boogers from freezing. Already have camping gear, basic recovery gear and a gen1 Tundy. :D

Signalprick

01-07-2009, 07:09 PM

Why do we have to refer to our off road vehicles as "RIGS"?

luni

01-07-2009, 07:12 PM

Why do some medics call an ambulance a bus?

Rig sounds better than POS and the way I abuse it if I call it a POS all the time it'll think I don't love it and it'll go back to it's mom's house.

Ebruddah

01-07-2009, 07:14 PM

Thanks, but I have figured out I don't need my own thread. This thread and reference to Overland Portal has helped me decide I don't need to buy a bunch of expensive stuff. A quote from Mr. Eastwood says it all: "Adapt and overcome".

:D

MUTHAFUCKING GUNNY HIGHWAY BITCHES!!!!

http://www.boekje-pienter.nl/images/heartbreakridge.jpg

Bloo

01-07-2009, 07:35 PM

Why do we have to refer to our off road vehicles as "RIGS"?
:clap:Excellent question -- I had to look that up, right after I got back from reversing the direction of my snorkel at luni's suggestion. From Wikipedia...
Rig may refer to:

Rig (band), a musical group of the early 1970s
Rig, Afghanistan
Rig, the configuration of sails and other rigging on a sailing vessel
Rigging, in computer animation, grouping the elements of parts such as limbs in a 3D model
Ríg (Norse god) or Heimdall, the father of mankind in Norse mythology
Radio Independents Group, the radio producers' trade organisation in the UK
RIG, the ticker symbol for Transocean Inc., an offshore drilling company
Rig, in skydiving, a parachute system
Rig, a horse-drawn carriage together with the horses and harness
Rigveda, in Hinduism, a sacred collection of Vedic Sanskrit hymns dedicated to the gods
Oil rig, a structure housing equipment used to drill or extract oil from underground
Big Rigs: Over the Road Racing, a video game
Rig, in abstract algebra, a humorous name for a semiring, being a ring without negative elements (n)
Rig, in amateur radio, a transmitter, receiver, or transceiver
Rig, a partially castrated male livestock animal, especially in cattle or horses
Gaming rig, a PC built for high-performance gaming
Rig, a slang word for a cigarette
Radiologically Inserted Gastrostomy, a feeding tube inserted into the stomach using radiology: see Interventional radiology
Rig, a slang term for a syringe used for injecting drugs, notably heroin
Rig, a slang term referring to a tractor unit, also called a "big rig" (US)
Rig, any expeditionary vehicle with an external, elevated, rearward facing air inlet

Well, there you have it...:D

Signalprick

01-07-2009, 08:24 PM

:clap:Excellent question -- I had to look that up, right after I got back from reversing the direction of my snorkel at luni's suggestion. From Wikipedia...
Rig, any expeditionary vehicle with am external, elevated, rearward facing air inlet

Well, there you have it...:D

I too googled RIG before I asked this question.......Missed this one!;)

Hunt4Steve

01-08-2009, 08:30 AM

Why do some medics call an ambulance a bus

I always thought of it as the "meat wagon".....:D

Topper

01-16-2009, 04:32 PM

This thread brings back memories of a safety meeting we had where we were setting mandatory equipment lists for our work vehicles. By the end of the day, I looked at the list and decided that I needed a bigger truck.

Willman

01-16-2009, 11:10 PM

What makes an expedition vehicle???

Full tank of gas, fridge full of food, maps, and an appetite for an adventure.

;)

Jacket

01-17-2009, 09:05 AM

What makes an expedition vehicle???

Full tank of gas, fridge full of food, maps, and an appetite for an adventure.

;)

You forgot the dutch oven Nic.;)

Willman

01-17-2009, 10:52 AM

You forgot the dutch oven Nic.;)

Sorry about that!....your making a fat guy hungry!!!

:cool:

Buddhadog

01-22-2009, 03:31 PM

You can tell who here hasn't been in third world countries where few vehicles are modified but take more of an everyday beating than most of the trucks on this forum ever will. People sometimes forget that most of the world doesn't have a road network like we do and just getting to town can be a rougher trip than some of our purposeful off-road trips. They routinely overload their vehicles (often cheap eastern-bloc or econo European cars) with both people and supplies. They carry livestock in the trunk, etc. According to some here, my father's Land Rover in Sudan (he's a geologist) wouldn't count because it was stock, but he carried extra water, fluids, tools, etc.

Jimmy Buffet was asked where Margaritaville was he said it's any place you want it to be, it's a state of mind. There aren't many places left unexplored these days- just unexplored by us. :driving:

TEJASYOTA

01-22-2009, 03:52 PM

....Jimmy Buffet was asked where Margaritaville was he said it's any place you want it to be, it's a state of mind. There aren't many places left unexplored these days- just unexplored by us. :driving:

Sounds like a good quote..... :)

Willman

01-22-2009, 04:11 PM

Jimmy Buffet was asked where Margaritaville was he said it's any place you want it to be, it's a state of mind. There aren't many places left unexplored these days- just unexplored by us. :driving:

Well said!

Margaritaville - Mexico.......Is a pretty nice place i hear:)

:D

Natas13

05-25-2009, 08:24 PM

But exactly 'what' makes a rig an expedition vehicle?

A purpose-built expedition vehicle should have:

1. Ability to carry more fuel than originally delivered from the dealer. Auxiliary fuel, be it an extended range fuel tank or on-board external fuel cans.
2. Self-sufficient - i.e. carries the basic needs of the occupants (along with basic vehicle repair items)
3. Extended range communication equipment
4. ???

4. Spending $100'000.00+ so you can "Drop the Kids off at the Pool"...inside your rig.:rolleyes: Meh, I don't know about you, I don't shit where I eat or sleep.

http://www.earthroamer.com/galleries/xv-jp_interior/img_0730_std.jpg

cadman

11-26-2009, 12:15 PM

What makes an expedition vehicle?

1. 4WD
2. Toyota

Necessary gear?

1. Brightly colored, loose fitting clothing.
2. Big yellow stickers.

http://englishrussia.com/?p=6600#more-6600

Bloo

11-26-2009, 01:16 PM

LMAO - Expo-panache!

corax

11-27-2009, 07:23 PM

What makes an expedition vehicle?

http://englishrussia.com/?p=6600#more-6600

Love this photo - as an experiment, show this to someone you know and ask them to point out the exped vehicle

http://englishrussia.com/wp-content/uploads/2009/11/133.jpg

BTW, reading this thread made me realize I need to add my NWMP tank to my sig so everyone knows how I roll :rolleyes:

Jomentum

11-27-2009, 10:17 PM

Packing list of neccesities :
http://bptravel.tripod.com/exeqlist.htm

corax

11-27-2009, 10:32 PM

Packing list of neccesities :
http://bptravel.tripod.com/exeqlist.htm

That is a fairly long list, and I realize it gives the discalimer, "It's not intended that you take all the stuff" but at the point you need a valve spring compressor you should just call it a day . . .

tspence

11-28-2009, 04:25 AM

MandAtaco

11-28-2009, 11:24 AM

What makes an expedition vehicle?

1. 4WD
2. Toyota

Necessary gear?

1. Brightly colored, loose fitting clothing.
2. Big yellow stickers.

http://englishrussia.com/?p=6600#more-6600

I like his pants.

ystanley

12-06-2009, 12:14 AM

i like that truck with the saw in the back

louis

12-09-2009, 10:48 PM

That is a fairly long list, and I realize it gives the discalimer, "It's not intended that you take all the stuff" but at the point you need a valve spring compressor you should just call it a day . . .

Lol, whats wrong with pulling a head and replacing a valve? Lol. And you can use alot of tools multiply. Like two vicegrips might work as a spring colapse, And if your desperate enough its amazing what you can acomplish with your bare hands. I would have no problem at all replacing a valve or even a rod/piston if i had to. But reusing a head gasket?? Might get ya home..

Dave 2000

01-18-2010, 12:13 AM

I have spent awhile now looking into preping a vehicle for expedition use and it is easy to get dragged in to a sort of jack up your home and slip wheels under it mindset. I have read about people asking if they will be able to catch a certain soap at a certain time on the 42" plasma that is going to be strapped to the roof:rolleyes: They then want to know what is the highest lift and wheel combo they can get under there ect.

IMHO the following is a good start:

Careful servicing of a pretty much stock 4x4, choose one that is common to the area you wish to visit.
Forget big wheels they are harder to replace but fit a good quality tyre.
Second spare wheel.
Upgrade springs and shocks a little lift maybe 2" but nothing that would involve screwing the drivetrain performance.
Weight must be kept below the GVW as much as possible so a decent payload rating.
Decent fuel range so perhaps an additional tank.
Winch

The rest is up to the individual with regards to survival, comfort ect

regards

Dave

miguelitro

01-18-2010, 06:47 PM

RAB89

01-31-2010, 02:49 AM

Just to add my two bits, there are gona be people (ME!) posting in this section, and talking about expo, that don't have an expo rig, but not everyone can just go out and buy all the coolest gear, load up and head out. We have to start somewhere, I wouldn't consider my tacoma an expedition vehicle at all, it's just my 4x4 truck, but it's going to take me from b.c canada, to texas and back pretty soon, thats a hell of an expedition,(4000km there and 5500km on the way back) I'll be living out of the canopy and a tent. it also takes me camping, on week long trips to remote places, and I have no issues.

I was also looking at this rig...
http://www.oramagazine.com/images/0504-apr/050401t-maya-hunter/10photo02.jpg
http://www.oramagazine.com/images/0504-apr/050401t-maya-hunter/10photo07.jpg
http://www.oramagazine.com/images/0504-apr/050401t-maya-hunter/10photo11.jpg

I realized that as cool as it looks as an expo rig, I wouldn't say it's any more of an expo rig than many of the ones on here, it just has the look.
There is a basket on the roof and in the back filled with stuff, but the bed of the truck is completely empty.....
when you really look at it, who doesn't have a hi-lift, shovel, axe, spare tire, jerry can and a tent?
If that truck wasn't loaded with stuff, it would just be a tacoma with an arb and some baskets...
Not really trying to make a point with that part of my post, but just sayin.

southpier

02-24-2010, 05:59 PM

.... the point is to get somewhere....

and enjoy yourself in the process

taco4x4rar

02-26-2010, 08:15 PM

http://www.oramagazine.com/images/0504-apr/050401t-maya-hunter/10photo11.jpg

Whats up with the ATV tire?

rocket-scientist

03-02-2010, 05:07 PM

An expedition vehicle is about the destination, not the journey. As in "I'm going to (secret location here)" instead of "I'm going rock crawling".

nine8taco

03-03-2010, 08:49 AM

i also agree and say its about the journey

Tacoma4life

03-05-2010, 01:37 AM

Cut and pasted from the Overland Journal website-

What is Overlanding?
History, wildlife, culture, scenery, self-sufficiency - these are the rewards of overlanding.

Overlanding describes self-reliant adventure travel to remote destinations where the journey is the primary goal. Typically, but not exclusively, accommodated by mechanized off-highway capable transport (from bicycles to trucks) where the principal form of lodging is camping; often lasting for extended lengths of time (months to years) and often spanning international boundaries. While expedition is defined as a journey with a purpose, overlanding sees the journey as the purpose.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Car Camping
Traveling in a vehicle to an established campground. If there is a picnic table there, it is probably car camping.
Back Country Adventure
A one-day or multi-day off-highway trip on an adventure motorcycle or in a 4WD vehicle.
Overland(ing)
Vehicle-supported, self-reliant adventure travel, typically exploring remote locations and interacting with other cultures.
Vehicle-Dependent Expedition
An organized, vehicle-dependent journey with a defined purpose, often geographic or scientific in nature.
Expedition Vehicle
A 4WD vehicle or adventure motorcycle prepared for self-reliant travel over long distances, through unpredictable weather and over variable terrain.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Technical terrain can be encountered throughout the journey, and the travelers may even seek out the most challenging route to a destination as part of their experience, but overland travel is not the same as recreational "fourwheeling", where the primary objective is overcoming challenging obstacles. The critical point to the term overland travel is that the purpose is to include at least two or more of the following: 1. Remote locations, 2. Cultures other than your own, 3. Under-explored or under-documented regions, 4. Self-reliance in unfamiliar territories for multiple days, weeks or months. That is to say, an overnight trip to the local mountains on a well-documented route, staying in an established campground with full-hookups, is not an overland adventure, it is a backcountry trip or at the very least, car camping.

Primary purpose: Exploration and adventure travel
Duration: Typically a week to many years. Can be only a few days if the route is particularly remote, challenging, or infrequently traveled.
Logistics: Detailed planning is required for environmental, geographic, and geopolitical contingencies.
Route Finding: Navigation is easy, typically on known routes that are well documented
Camping: Remote or established campgrounds
International Borders: Rarely includes crossing of international borders
Risk: Low risk to personnel, moderate risk to equipment on more challenging tracks.
Terrain: Backcountry travel often includes challenging trails as part of the adventure, with trails like the Dusy Ershim and longer routes in Moab, Utah being an example.