winch question- mile marker pe8000

[cabo john]

I am in the market for a winch. Going on a ARB bumper / 2000 Taco 4x4.
I found the Mile Marker PE8000 at Costco for $369.
Any reason I shouldn't buy it?

[diablo_alex2777]

Waz up John! I have the same winch and i have use it about 20 times and it has never failed me. I like mine.

[SAR_Squid79]

That's a decent winch for a good price. Very slow line speed from what I understand, but otherwise a good winch.

[rader]

I am in the market for a winch. Going on a ARB bumper / 2000 Taco 4x4.
I found the Mile Marker PE8000 at Costco for $369.
Any reason I shouldn't buy it?

Look up the difference between permanent magnet motors and series wound motors. You will see why most decent winches today use series wound motors even the Smittybuilt 8000# winch that sells for $299 is series wound. I personaly would not buy a winch with a permanent magnet motor but thats me. It's your call, it's your winch, but I though I would alert you about the motor difference, so you could decide if a P-M or S-W winch motor is the best choice for you.

[Mr Tacomi]

That's a decent winch for a good price. Very slow line speed from what I understand, but otherwise a good winch.

x2

My older MileMarker is a crawler for sure, but gets the job done...if I didn't already own it, and if it would just die, I'd get a newer Warn... but I do, and it won't, so I just keep it.

[toymota]

I went to winch depot to try to find you the same great deal I got on the warn m-8000 (not much more than that MileMarker). As it turns out things have gotten a bit more expensive.

If you like the smittybuilt (I know nothing about it, but don't like permenant magnet motors)

They may still have what you are looking for

http://www.winchdepot.com/Winches-Winch-Accessories/SmittyBilt-Electric-Winch-8-000-to-10-500-lbs.aspx?t_c=18&t_s=300&t_pt=100702&t_pl=6426

I've seen the MM pull its ass off, so I'm sure that is a fine winch to buy.

[hytenor]

That's a decent winch for a good price. Very slow line speed from what I understand, but otherwise a good winch.
yea, slower than the Warns...I (XD9000) had to stop/start while Dick (MM8000) and I were winching Dale's rig out of the canyon ;)
but, they do the job and for less $.

[TacoDell]

I am in the market for a winch. Going on a ARB bumper / 2000 Taco 4x4.
I found the Mile Marker PE8000 at Costco for $369.
Any reason I shouldn't buy it?

Get anything... dammit... :D

any winch you buy... will mean less duty for my Warn ;)

when yer new junk breaks... I'll save you http://foolstown.com/sm/pop.gif

[rader]

I see members that have older M-M like them, were the older M-M made in China ?
Looking at the Specs of the Chinese winches Mile Marker and H-F use the lowest gear ratios, It could be the motors are low HP so they gear them low to get the 8000 rating, if you look up the specs a Warn 6000 will pull more for the first couple of wraps, the mile marker only pulls more with 3 or more wraps out. Then it is pulling at glacier like speed, you could 3-part the W-6000 and it would still pull faster (and more). Some of the other Chinese winch's have bigger S-W motors and higher gear ratios so they pull faster. SuperWinch is spendy but they match up with Warn. I guess I got spoiled on line speed running a Belleview 8000(W-8274) and W-HS9500 winches I like to be able to power ahead while winching and have the winch keep up with creep speed. Then I don't get slack and some loose wound line, when the truck get moving on it's own. Anyway What ever winch you buy the first time it pulls you out you will kick your ass for not buying one sooner.

[cabo john]

Thanks for all the feed back & information. It really helped. :kewl:

The winch is one of those things that will probably not get used much but will be handy if I ever need it!
Sure there are better & faster winches out there...the guys who have Warn & other higher end winches seem to love them! :)
I can't justify spending any more coin on a better winch for a 10 year old truck that may not be around in a few years? I can live with a slow winch as long as it gets the job done when needed.
One thing I like about buying from Costco is they are very good about returning defective items if need be.;)

I think I am sold on the Costco Mile Marker based on feedback & cost.
I will check out the smittybuilt before I pull the trigger. The price is right...but cost doesn't always equal value.:confused:

Thanks again!

[Irish_11]

Thanks for the heads up on the Costco deal. Thats not too bad considering I get 3% back for my membership and my friend gets 5% so I passed it along to him.

[RaideRNatioN]

Another good winch for the money....look into the Smittybuilt XRC8. Theres a big thread on Pirate about them. They are 4WP brand and chinese, but they hold up to some good abuse. I got mine from winchdepot.com for around $350 shipped.

[rader]

Another good winch for the money....look into the Smittybuilt XRC8. Theres a big thread on Pirate about them. They are 4WP brand and chinese, but they hold up to some good abuse. I got mine from winchdepot.com for around $350 shipped.

They are $310 shipped from winch depo now, a few places have advertised them for $299 shipped. They have a 5.5hp series wound motor, the milemarker has a 4.1 PM motor. I noticed one thread on Pirate started out in 07 and it seems like most are pleased with this winch. There has been threads about them on every single Jeep forum and most post have been positive from the Jeep guys. They have more HP and higher gears so they will be faster than MM, they would have my vote for best buy on a budget winch.

The new Smittybilt XRC-8 Winch encompasses all the best features you would want in a winch. Every XRC-8 (8,000 LB.) winch features a 5.5HP Series Wound Motor and a Planetary Gear System with 172.8:1 gear ratio that will deliver power and reliability at a premium price. For a recovery system with the muscle and dependability to bail you out of any situation, the XRC-8 has all the heavy duty toughness youre looking for.

[KYN8]

They are $310 shipped from winch depo now, a few places have advertised them for $299 shipped.

An extra $200 gets you a winch cover, synthetic line, aluminum fairlead...worth the extra money?

[hytenor]

An extra $200 gets you a winch cover, synthetic line, aluminum fairlead...worth the extra money?

the line alone is worth that.

[WallyP226]

Does anybody else besides me have first hand experience with permanent magnet verses series wound winch motors?

I have a Belleview 8000, we bought it used in 1972, it set on the front of an FJ40 up into the 90s. It was used quite a bit when it set on the front of the FJ. I have it on a reciever hitch, its got several dozen uses on it. Typically the pulls have been 10 or 15 feet, but it also has several sustained pulls, like 100+ yard pulls. Its the original winch motor, other than changing out the fairly warn brushes (which should give one an idea of how much it had been used), thats it.

How many people wouldn't feel they got their money's worth out of a winch motor thats 35+ years old? The solenoids will go long before the motor.

I am not suggesting that series wound isn't superior, what I am trying to say is that permament magnet motors are not as bad as they are portrayed. I drug a new 2006 FJ out of frame deep mud well over 150 yards a couple of years ago with a 37 year old permanent magnet winch rated at 8000lbs, single straight pull.

Wally

[rader]

Does anybody else besides me have first hand experience with permanent magnet verses series wound winch motors?

I have a Belleview 8000, we bought it used in 1972, it set on the front of an FJ40 up into the 90s. It was used quite a bit when it set on the front of the FJ. I have it on a reciever hitch, its got several dozen uses on it. Typically the pulls have been 10 or 15 feet, but it also has several sustained pulls, like 100+ yard pulls. Its the original winch motor, other than changing out the fairly warn brushes (which should give one an idea of how much it had been used), thats it.

How many people wouldn't feel they got their money's worth out of a winch motor thats 35+ years old? The solenoids will go long before the motor.

I am not suggesting that series wound isn't superior, what I am trying to say is that permament magnet motors are not as bad as they are portrayed. I drug a new 2006 FJ out of frame deep mud well over 150 yards a couple of years ago with a 37 year old permanent magnet winch rated at 8000lbs, single straight pull.

Wally

I thought you had a Belleview 6000, I had a Belleview 8000 and mentioned it in this very thread. They were a different animal Wally, the line speed made up for a lot but the motor was like a Ford truck starter and would kill a battery quicker than any other winch i ever owned. I do count 3 people that mention owning or seeing MM winches in action, they would all be PM.

[WallyP226]

The time in use ie 37 years should be an indication of the longevity of permanent magnet motors, line speed has nothing to do with 37 years. Permanent magnet motors have a lower amp draw as well.

Here is a pic of mine, in a mock up for a reciever winch hitch. I bought some solenoids from DB electric, bought a solenoid case and wired it up with a controller.

http://i65.photobucket.com/albums/h224/WallyP226/100_0593.jpg

I would be more apt to believe that a quality issue in manufacturer would be the cause and less to do with the motor type.

Oh and the STOCK OEM battery lasted 5 years.

Wally

[WallyP226]

A link to Warn's original M8000,Belleview M6000 parts brochure.

http://www.ih8mud.com/tech/warn5687.php

Cool rebuild and some history the original M8000.

http://www.pirate4x4.com/forum/showthread.php?referrerid=57133&t=382401

Wally

[rader]

The time in use ie 37 years should be an indication of the longevity of permanent magnet motors, line speed has nothing to do with 37 years. Permanent magnet motors have a lower amp draw as well.
I would be more apt to believe that a quality issue in manufacturer would be the cause and less to do with the motor type.
Oh and the STOCK OEM battery lasted 5 years.
Wally

You miss my point Wally line speed has everything to do with how long a motor is running and heating on a given length pull. When I said my Belleview would kill a battery quick I meant as in discharge, shit we are talking about winching not battery longevity. A PM motor draws less amps initially but as a PM motor heats it draws more amps and loses power.

Motor quality is an issue, but when you compare equal quality motors a series wound motor is is the BEST for winch use, thats why ALL top quality winches made in 2009 use them. 37 years ago was another time another place, thing made today are different, the technology is definitely better but the quality is not.

[Quote] A permanent magnetic motor will pull the same as a series wound motor, at less of an amperage draw on the battery and charging system. However, as the permanent magnet motor gets warmer, the power will drop as the amperage draw will increase. The amperage draw on a series wound motor will stay the same throughout the duty cycle.[Quote]

[WallyP226]

Rader,

Ever winched 300 yards in the last 5 years? I have. Have you winched 200 yards in the last couple of years? I have, and I did it with a belleview. This isn't my first rodeo with a winch, or my first decade with one.

It doesn't matter how fast a winch is, if its under load for 900 feet thats is a lot of winching. 37 years of winching is well.............. a winch that has 37 years with a permanent magnet motor winching, 100 feet at a time. :) Still original motor, less the brushes.


Here is comparison, apples to apples PERMANANT magnet motor a Harbor Freight no less verses all the name brands.

http://www.moabjeeper.com/articles/general/listing.cfm?articleID=353

Why didn't the HF burn up if permanent magnet motors are pieces of junk?

[rader]

Rader,

Ever winched 300 yards in the last 5 years? I have. Have you winched 200 yards in the last couple of years? I have, and I did it with a belleview. This isn't my first rodeo with a winch, or my first decade with one.

It doesn't matter how fast a winch is, if its under load for 900 feet thats is a lot of winching. 37 years of winching is well.............. a winch that has 37 years with a permanent magnet motor winching, 100 feet at a time. :) Still original motor, less the brushes.


Here is comparison, apples to apples PERMANANT magnet motor a Harbor Freight no less verses all the name brands.

http://www.moabjeeper.com/articles/general/listing.cfm?articleID=353

Why didn't the HF burn up if permanent magnet motors are pieces of junk?

Jeez Wally your kind of going off the deep end!! You better go back and read this thread, no one has said PM motors are Junk
what has been said is that they work well but make for a slow winch and heat up. No one has said not to buy a low cost winch either, we all buy the best we can afford and thats it. It's just better to be educated about features and specs, so you can make an informed decision and get the best bang for your buck in the first place, than to say man I wish I would have known that before I bought.
Whatever, you like PM I like series I think we can agree to disagree on that issue.

So you want to sharp shoot me on winching good luck on that too, I noticed the distances of winching you want me to match is only only 100yds thank god, you did report a 150 yd pull LOL, on the other hand your winch grew, it used to be a B-6000. It used to be mounted on an FJ but came off in the nineties, It is now mounted on a receiver hitch and has had several dozen pulls since it came off your FJ. Yes I do read what you say carefully.

[Quote Wally] "I have a Belleview 6000 with the permanent magnet motor, original motor too, less new brushes. New brushes should give a hint at the amount of use it has seen in the last 35+ years. We broke 5/16s cable with it on a straight pull a few years back. Take good care of a permanent magnet motor an it will take care of you." [ Quote]

And that was on 4-15-09 the pictures looked the same so I assume it just grew a little, the fish I catch do the same thing, pretty soon a Rainbow is the size of a great white shark LOL.

Did I winch 900 ft well not in one pull my winch only holds 100' of cable. I don't want to get in a winching distance pissing contest I doubt you have the winching opportunities I do. I live on a dirt road in the mountains next to a lot of rugged trails. The trails get bad when it snows they are steep and narrow you end up winching up hills 100 ft at a time till you can move or come to a spot that is flat and wide enough to turn around without turning over, You live in the flatlands not a good comparison. I don't know why the Belleview song and dance either, you are comparing a winch = W-8274 that now comes with a SERIES wound motor and that cost around $1,500 bucks to good, but low cost Chinese winches. Again we each buy what we like and can afford, or spend what we can justify based on how much use we will get out of our winch.

[WallyP226]

I agree that one should purchase what they can afford. Not saying that the series isn't a better motor, but permanent magnet motors are durable enough for most automotive applications. Performance is often the bigger issue with permanent magnet motors not motor durability. This was my point originally before all the tangents. :rolleyes:

Alas, I posted up evidences that permanent magnet motors are durable, so that the OP can use the information to decide for himself whether or not he wants to purchase the winch, based upon an independent test.





Wally

[WallyP226]

Hi Rader,

I am not interested in getting into a a emotional pissing contest on tangents that are off the topic. :rolleyes: Would prefer a mature discussion about the differences between series and permanent magnet winches verses all the tangents. I see nothing wrong with debating first hand experiences, but no need to accuse or argue over fine points of triviality. Actually I own both series and a permanent magnet winches, I have a lot more experience with the Belleview than I do the Ramsey on the front of my CJ7.

I stand by my facts, I gave some evidences of the facts, I don't have any reason to lie or tell tall tales. I don't know anything about sharp shooting, I do know that I have been messing with the same winch for over 20 years personally. So I know how much its been used, and I know how much my father used it before I inherited it. Thats why I mentioned 37 years old winch AND the distances its been used. The point is, in my experience, permanent magnet winch motors are far more durable than given credit for. Mine gets used monthly on average and with the amount of use and abuse its taken, if durability was an issue, I would have had to put a new motor in it.

Wally

[rader]

LOL It's all good Wally try not to get grumpy, The fish story was a joke, if it was off topic what can I say. The sharp shoot was a play to your sig
"THE THREAD SNIPER" come on Wally lighten up.
I also wanted to slow the growth of your old Belleville down in this thread. The description of the B-8000 winch you mentioned in this thread sounds identical to the winch you mentioned as a B-6000 and pictured in a previous thread, I was afraid it would be back as a 10K in the next thread. JUST JOKING WALLY ( link below).
It must have been a typo, that happens to us all occasionally.
http://www.ttora.com/forum/showthread.php?t=129689

[WallyP226]

I hope to be back on meds by tomorrow. :D

I forgot all about that thread. LOL

My PM winch is a Belleview 6000, it doesn't say that on the Bellview tag, but thats what I believe it is.

Wally

[two4four2one]

I have owned a Milemarker E8000, Harbor Freight 8000# winch(Milemarker, Ramsey knockoff) and the Smittybuilt XRC8(Warn M8000 knockoff).

My Milemarker was purchased in 2001. Slow. The motor burned up in 2008. (My buddy bought one around the same time as I did and he went through a lot of solenoids.)

My Harbor Freight winch was purchased in 2005 and I sold it in 2008. Like the "real" Milemarker that I had it was extremely slow but did get the job done eventually.

My Smittybuilt winch works way faster than the other 2 did. I almost got my hand pulled into my hawse fairlead when I was putting my 8 year old Masterpull line on it. I had no idea how fast the series would motors are. It was scary after being used to the MM and HF winches. I am used to it now and I will never go back to PM winches. I will even buy another Smitty winch for the rear of my rig with synthetic line as well.

Based on my experiences I have to say that the series wound motor is superior.

[ecchamberlin]

I just ordered the pkg deal for the Smittybuilt w/synthetic line also. I think this is a good deal. I have read as many of the reviews as I could find out there including the very long 2yr thread on Pirate4x4. The old one worked well but the new one is supposed to be a big improvement.

Anyway I wanted to keep the weight down on the front end and at the same time have a safer line.

The link if you are intersted:

http://www.winchdepot.com/Winches-Winch-Accessories/XRC-8-Winch-W-Synthetic-Rope-Aluminum-Fairlead.aspx?t_c=18&t_s=300&t_pt=100702&t_pl=6426&t_pn=S%2fB98281

[WallyP226]

Line speed is also related to a combination of horsepower and gear ratios. In other words, for a PM motor to maintain the same winch speed, it would need a bigger motor, however the trend over the last 5 years has been 4+hp electric motors on winches, and its hard to compete with a bigger motor in regards to line speed when a lot of the older winches came with 3sh-4 hp motors.

Thats true even with series wound, compare the line speed between two winches rated for 8k or 9K with different horsepowered motors. The higher horsepower can tolerate higher gears, has more torque and therefore more faster linespeed loaded or unloaded.


A thought on killing solenoids is to use larger solenoids or run two in paralell.

Wally

[Mr Tacomi]

My Milemarker was purchased in 2001. Slow. The motor burned up in 2008. (My buddy bought one around the same time as I did and he went through a lot of solenoids.)



I have a similar 'vintage' MM8000 that the motor went up in a blaze of glory one winchfest pulling 3 diesel F350's out of the muck.... ran that motor until it stopped...smoke pouring out of every orifice..LOL! It did get everyone out that dark & stormy night, though. It was on a receiver, I wrapped the cable around it and threw it in the corner. In early '07 (three years later) I bought the Tacoma, and thought I'd give a call to MM to see if they had a motor to replace my toasted one. Gave them the serial# and they said that there was a recall/replacement on the motor.. it was undersized, 2.5 HP, and should have been a 4.5 HP.. they shipped it out that day and two years later, with pretty regular trail use, it's still slowly pulling it's way around stuck folks. I would like to put something faster on there, but until it fails, I can't make myself replace it.

[two4four2one]

I have a similar 'vintage' MM8000 that the motor went up in a blaze of glory one winchfest pulling 3 diesel F350's out of the muck.... ran that motor until it stopped...smoke pouring out of every orifice..LOL! It did get everyone out that dark & stormy night, though. It was on a receiver, I wrapped the cable around it and threw it in the corner. In early '07 (three years later) I bought the Tacoma, and thought I'd give a call to MM to see if they had a motor to replace my toasted one. Gave them the serial# and they said that there was a recall/replacement on the motor.. it was undersized, 2.5 HP, and should have been a 4.5 HP.. they shipped it out that day and two years later, with pretty regular trail use, it's still slowly pulling it's way around stuck folks. I would like to put something faster on there, but until it fails, I can't make myself replace it.

Hmm I will have to try and locate the serial number on my MM E8000 (sitting in the garage in pieces) and try to see whether mine was part of the recall. I actually called MM last year and was told that they don't list a replacement motor for the E8000. I understand the newer model is the PE8000 so I wonder if that is the 4.5HP motor that you referred to. If I could salvage the winch then I could use it as a rear mount winch underneath my flatbed. Failing that, I will just pop the money for another Smittybuilt XRC- probably get the 10K one to put in my winch bumper and move the 8K out back.

[Stealth 4x4]

Hmm I will have to try and locate the serial number on my MM E8000 (sitting in the garage in pieces) and try to see whether mine was part of the recall. I actually called MM last year and was told that they don't list a replacement motor for the E8000. I understand the newer model is the PE8000 so I wonder if that is the 4.5HP motor that you referred to. If I could salvage the winch then I could use it as a rear mount winch underneath my flatbed. Failing that, I will just pop the money for another Smittybuilt XRC- probably get the 10K one to put in my winch bumper and move the 8K out back.

Sorry for digging up an old thread, but I am looking at winches now too. That Smittybuilt 10K winch has a lower gear ratio, which from reading this thread means that it will have a slower line speed. I would think that if line speed is a big determining factor, that would be something to keep in mind. I am looking at these two XRC models (the 8 and 10) and I am thinking maybe the "8 is enough" hahaha. (172.8:1 and 218:1 gear ratios for the 8 and 10, respectively) Basically they look like they are the same winch motor, they just geared the 10 lower to reach the 10K pull capacity.

$499 for the XRC-8 with 100 feet of 8,000 lb rated synth line and aluminum hawse fairlead, with controller box sound like a decent price?

[CronusTRD]

$499 for the XRC-8 with 100 feet of 8,000 lb rated synth line and aluminum hawse fairlead, with controller box sound like a decent price?


ntwonline.com has them for $399 + shipping ($38 for me).

I ordered one for suckdown duty on my Competition Jeep.

[Stealth 4x4]

Nice!

[hytenor]

ntwonline.com has them for $399 + shipping ($38 for me).

I ordered one for suckdown duty on my Competition Jeep.

wow, killer price...the line alone will run over $100

I don't see the deal you describe on their site :confused:

[CronusTRD]

wow, killer price...the line alone will run over $100

I don't see the deal you describe on their site :confused:

http://www.ntwonline.com/XRC_8000_ELECTRIC_WINCH_W_SYN_P15766.cfm

[hytenor]

http://www.ntwonline.com/XRC_8000_ELECTRIC_WINCH_W_SYN_P15766.cfm

I suck at the intarweb...:rolleyes:

hell of a deal...if the winch is any good. At that price it is all made in China, however...

so far...so good...
http://www.offroaders.com/reviewbox/showproduct.php?product=628
http://www.jeepfan.com/revpost/showproduct.php?product=241