2 link or Radius arm setups

[CornbredNE]

I was just wondering if we could get some of the links to any of the 2 link buildups that have already been done. I already have a pretty good idea how I want to do mine and it's going to be kindof build as I go since I'm using the Dana 60 front that I'm already using, but looking at some other setups would be nice for some of the finishing touch ideas.

Thanks,
David

[HardTaco]

I know it's a landcruiser, but here's some shots of my links.
http://www.scottkarg.com/fj40pics/

[AK98Taco]

I was just wondering if we could get some of the links to any of the 2 link buildups that have already been done. I already have a pretty good idea how I want to do mine and it's going to be kindof build as I go since I'm using the Dana 60 front that I'm already using, but looking at some other setups would be nice for some of the finishing touch ideas.

Thanks,
David

Hey, David,

Here is a great thread on Pirate about front suspension setup. A lot of good ideas and helpful, need-to-know info.

http://www.pirate4x4.com/forum/showthread.php?t=307322

I'm looking to do a modified radius arm setup like Dick Foster:

http://www.norcalttora.com/~dick/

The radius arm setup seems to be a lot easier to get working properly, and with less math required.
If you use coilovers, you can adjust the height of the mounts to change chassis height and change the length of the coilover to adjust the travel and overall ride height.

I want to see pics when you start doing this. Should be cool.

[CornbredNE]

I know it's a landcruiser, but here's some shots of my links.
http://www.scottkarg.com/fj40pics/

Thanks Scott

Later,
David

[Dick Foster]

I don't have any links of note but I will be happy to answer questions, David. :D

[cb77DEMELLO]

what are you looking for? Mine is not 2 link but it does work:)

[Dick Foster]

What's that??? :rolleyes:
Last I heard you wouldn't drive it because of the brakes and something else. You didn't think I was going to let you get away with that did you? :xdevil: :rofl:

[zszac111]

I know it's a landcruiser, but here's some shots of my links.
http://www.scottkarg.com/fj40pics/

FJ's kick ass :xrocker:

[DesertTRD]

HEY DICK :stfu:

[Dick Foster]

:xmoon: Who rattled your cage?

[CornbredNE]

I don't have any links of note but I will be happy to answer questions, David. :D

I need some insight on the rear mounting point there at the tranny crossmember. I was thinking of using Rod End style mounting points there instead of the through shaft style like the old design that Ford (and you) used. Is this something you considered? Any suggestions?

One other thing, I was thinking because of the amount of lift that I'll have at around 14" suspension lift that I'll have the shorter link on the bottom of the main link rather than on the top like yours is...any insight or suggestions on this?

Last of all, how did you mount the axle end mounting points to the axle? Was the axle that you used originally a leafsprung or radius arm?

Thanks for your time.
David

[cb77DEMELLO]

What's that??? :rolleyes:
Last I heard you wouldn't drive it because of the brakes and something else. You didn't think I was going to let you get away with that did you? :xdevil: :rofl:
The brakes are good enough to drive right now, I just need to get dirty and weld some brackets and shit in place! I'm laggin big time!

it drives good tho! Just doesn't stop worth a shit! the mech across the street says I have a air bubble and need to bleed it some more!

I would take it out right now! But I'm really busy!

[cb77DEMELLO]

I need some insight on the rear mounting point there at the tranny crossmember. I was thinking of using Rod End style mounting points there instead of the through shaft style like the old design that Ford (and you) used. Is this something you considered? Any suggestions?

One other thing, I was thinking because of the amount of lift that I'll have at around 14" suspension lift that I'll have the shorter link on the bottom of the main link rather than on the top like yours is...any insight or suggestions on this?

Last of all, how did you mount the axle end mounting points to the axle? Was the axle that you used originally a leafsprung or radius arm?

Thanks for your time.
David
Not that you asked but I'll give you my picks..lol

Where it mounts to the frame, I used johnny joints, not the cheapest but they rotate more than hiems and are rebuildable. I used them at both ends. I mounted my links where the drive shaft spits out of the transfer case and now I have very little drive shaft movement, 1in from top to bottom to be exact!

remeber the higher you go the lower your rear mounts need to be. Just for reference my frame is 24in from the ground and my pivot mounting points are 2in below that. I'm guessing I have about 6in of lift total with my 1.5in body lift. There is some good info on the pirate board about geomtry of the suspension and how effects what and where.

Good luck, the end results are really worth it when your tires rarely leave the ground and you feel safe and comfortable the whole time your wheelin:)

[AK98Taco]

One other thing, I was thinking because of the amount of lift that I'll have at around 14" suspension lift that I'll have the shorter link on the bottom of the main link rather than on the top like yours is...any insight or suggestions on this?

The Pirate thread I linked to has some very good info about the geometry issue. One thing that is very important is that the links need to be as perpendicular to the axle as possible.

There is also a big factor in 3-links: I believe that if the upper link is on the drivers side, it must be going from below axle centerline to above, and if the upper link is used on the passenger side, it must come from above axle centerline.

There is a decent amount of physics that goes into it. Keeping the front from diving upon brake application yet also keeping the front planted on hills and not allowing it to torque or flex when power is applied.

This is good stuff: http://www.pirate4x4.com/forum/showthread.php?t=307322

[snowchucker]

On Jeff's rig he did what you said and put the longer link up on top and the short on the bottom. you better have a hp axle, or your driveshaft will be the first thing to hit. it drove fine, but he switched it back around. if you go this route make sure you use at least 2"x.375 wall for those lowers, they will get beat. (dick's are .5" thick)
we use 1 1/4" heims or Jimmy Joints (bling heims), for the upper joints and 'X' joints for the axle mounts. Going to try out the Currie joints jason used next time, since we've exploded a few 'X' joints already. just dont use bushings anywhere... they suck and will need to be replaced if you flog it. On Dick's he used the stock type radius arm bushing setup and the axle mounts are solid machined steel w/ 3/4" grade 8 bolts. the arms bolt to modified ford 'c's which have two 5/16" plates welded to the out sides of them. the 'c's then bolt onto the axle w/ the standard radius arm bushings.

[CornbredNE]

On Jeff's rig he did what you said and put the longer link up on top and the short on the bottom. you better have a hp axle, or your driveshaft will be the first thing to hit. it drove fine, but he switched it back around. if you go this route make sure you use at least 2"x.375 wall for those lowers, they will get beat. (dick's are .5" thick)
we use 1 1/4" heims or Jimmy Joints (bling heims), for the upper joints and 'X' joints for the axle mounts. Going to try out the Currie joints jason used next time, since we've exploded a few 'X' joints already. .

Ok, just a few questions.

1) Yes, I have a HP axle, but what and where would it hit the driveshaft? With a Radius arm style setup the arms wouldn't be anywhere near the driveshaft.

2) I had planned on using heavy tubing, but 1/2"...that sounds a little overkill, even for as rough as I wheel?

3)What are good supply sources for the heims? I'm planning on going with 1 or 1-1/4 heims, but having trouble locating suppliers.

Thanks,
David

[ptrautne]

Ok, just a few questions.

1) Yes, I have a HP axle, but what and where would it hit the driveshaft? With a Radius arm style setup the arms wouldn't be anywhere near the driveshaft.

2) I had planned on using heavy tubing, but 1/2"...that sounds a little overkill, even for as rough as I wheel?

3)What are good supply sources for the heims? I'm planning on going with 1 or 1-1/4 heims, but having trouble locating suppliers.

Thanks,
David

I believe that he is talking about how the arms work as sliders for your drive shaft but if you put the longer link on top the first part to get hit will be your drive shaft

[DylanICON]

I’m not a big fan of radius arms, some reputable vehicles have used them but they were most notable used by Ford…..that doesn’t speak highly for the concept in general. Ford also used the twin traction 4X4 leaf spring set up=crap

In that thread on the pirate board referenced above….listen to what is said by “Goat1”

He is also a suspension engineer and a good friend of mine even though he is a Jeep enthusiast.

here is a thread on his jeep

http://www.pirate4x4.com/forum/showthread.php?t=164299&page=1&pp=25&highlight=goat1

[Crash]

I’m not a big fan of radius arms, some reputable vehicles have used them but they were most notable used by Ford…..that doesn’t speak highly for the concept in general. Ford also used the twin traction 4X4 leaf spring set up=crap

In that thread on the pirate board referenced above….listen to what is said by “Goat1”

He is also a suspension engineer and a good friend of mine even though he is a Jeep enthusiast.

here is a thread on his jeep

http://www.pirate4x4.com/forum/showthread.php?t=164299&page=1&pp=25&highlight=goat1


Dylan, Just wanted to let you know I got to check out the Donahoe tacoma today at the sand and dirt show in Phoenix. Nice job on the rear quarter!
:D

[DylanICON]

Dylan, Just wanted to let you know I got to check out the Donahoe tacoma today at the sand and dirt show in Phoenix. Nice job on the rear quarter!
:D

Thanks. I think it gives it character!
That was after we pulled it out about a foot.

[snowchucker]

what pratnue said....you will no longer have leaf springs or lower links to protect the driveshaft if your running a low pinion.

[snowchucker]

god i wish i had the time, money, and equipment to build stuff like that.... extremely nice work.
for the radius arm setup, it is not the best design at all, but its easy and suites my needs fine.

[PappaF2]

hey chuck how about some specs on your radius arms? Total length, tubing size, vertical seperation at the axle, joints/bushings used, spacing between the driverside and passenger side arm, and anthing else you can think of that is pertinat. I'm thinking more about radius arms as with the space avalible on the taco a 3 link plus panhard will mean compromises made no matter which way it gets set up.

[HardTaco]

what pratnue said....you will no longer have leaf springs or lower links to protect the driveshaft if your running a low pinion.That's why you run beef for a front ds.

http://www.scottkarg.com/fj40pics/slides/P1010076.JPG

[boophoenix]

3)What are good supply sources for the heims? I'm planning on going with 1 or 1-1/4 heims, but having trouble locating suppliers.

Thanks,
David

You might check out chassisshop.com I have never purchased from them but they have some cool products. The largest I saw was a 1 inch heim. They may have some new ones by now. They may be a bit pricey though as it's a teflon coated heim.

ball dia 1", thread size 1 1/4-12, ball width 1.375, degree of misalignment 17, radial load capacity 76,200 lbs, left and right hand $127.81

12.78 cheaper each if ya buy 10 or more @ 115.03.

It apears the Aurora bearings go to 2" in 1/4 steps or more custom ordered.

[Puckett]

I need some insight on the rear mounting point there at the tranny crossmember. I was thinking of using Rod End style mounting points there instead of the through shaft style like the old design that Ford (and you) used. Is this something you considered? Any suggestions?

One other thing, I was thinking because of the amount of lift that I'll have at around 14" suspension lift that I'll have the shorter link on the bottom of the main link rather than on the top like yours is...any insight or suggestions on this?

Last of all, how did you mount the axle end mounting points to the axle? Was the axle that you used originally a leafsprung or radius arm?

Thanks for your time.
David


I know some guys in the Nissan/Mitsubishi crowd are using the James Duff radius arms for early Broncos. These are a big solid radius arm with a heim at the pivot (frame) end.

http://www.4x4extremesports.com/ifs-conversion-1.php

Krawlr's Tacoma uses the James Duff radius arms but his airbag suspension doesn't flex too well - luckily he can fix being offcamber with the flip of a switch and adjust pressure in the bags

http://www.krawlr.com


Others have used the standard Ford radius arms

http://www.cn4xc.com/members/chris.htm
http://www.nissanoffroad.net/messageboard/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=14027

A company called Calmini has made a kit For Nissans using a 2-link setup:
http://webpages.charter.net/cmxterra/sas/

This guy did a I-Beam (2 link) on an Amigo:
http://www.houlster.com/amigo/SAS/

These guys did a Radius Arm SAS on a..... Bronco? lol
http://www.wt4wheeling.com/tech/sas2.htm


Theres probly more out there, but that is what I found on Google. A custom I-beam type arm with a Johnny on the frame end, then coil overs or coils or air bags or whatever. It' be cool.

[Puckett]

Here's another 2-link. He did a 2-link with no panhard. The driver's side link is a horizontal triangle that connects from the frame to the long tube of his front axle in tow places, and the passenger's side is a triangle that connects to the short side vertically. He says it does well but maybe not for conventional steering - he has full hydro.

http://www.pirate4x4.com/forum/showpost.php?p=3535072&postcount=11

[Puckett]

uh, Bueller?..... Bueller?..... Bueller?