different tire widths

[ziggy428]

I have a 95 tacoma, would there be any problems with running 14" wide tires in the rear and maybe 10-12" wide tires in the front besides not being able to rotate every 7,000mi?
Thanks.

[00regcab]

:confused:

why would you want to do that anyway?

a tire that wide wouldnt get traction for shit in the snow, plus it'll rub like crazy.

Personally, i think a 265/75 would fill your wheel wells quite nice.

Or maybe even what jeremy and i think a few others are running (255/85)

[jarboarder1]

I have no idea why you would want to go that wide. It doesn't make any sense plus that would look real stupid with the smaller tires up front. The widest I would go is 285.
but do whatever you want:confused:

[Dailydriver2]

Go tall and semi-narrow. You won't regret it.

[ziggy428]

I'd probably get 33x10 or 12's for rock crawling purposes is that close to a 285? One thing I forgot is skinnier tires on front is bad for turning radius but wider is harder on components. I suppose it wouldn't really matter as much for rock crawling because you don't gain any clearance but in mud and sand you would double you flotation. If you look at alot of sand rails they all have big rear wheels where the power goes. Been doing some reading on co 4x4 and can't decide. http://www.colorado4x4.org/vbb/showthread.php?t=73904&highlight=mud+wider+tires
super swampers: http://www.intercotire.com/site33.php

[thefatkid]

Yeah, that is a little wide even by my standards. It sounds as if you have 3 or so inches of lift. I think the 305/70/16(33x12.5) would fit ok, it would rub while steering if you don't clearance it and run the wrong offset wheel. I run a 295/75/16 about 11.5" wide, My next tire will be a 305/70/16.

Wider is better when.... (12.50)
running in the sand (along with low pressure)
Snow bashing (for floation in deep snow)

Narrow is better when.... (9.50)
wet road traction
small amounts of snow (when you need to dig down)
Fuel economy (less rolling resistance)

Many debate the narrow/wide al the time. I have never been shown up by a narrow truck of equal drive line, nor have I shown one up. The only time I've seen any major difference was on the sand or in the deep snow.

Even after all that is said, if the outside diameter is the same front to back you could run a 6.50" and a 20" if you wanted.

Edit: my wifes 4runner runs a 33 10.5 on the road it doesn't feel much different then my truck

[Dailydriver2]

285/75-16 = 33x11.5

:D

[RedRunnertc]

The only undebatable item in this discussion is that for a given amount of lift, you can run a taller tire if it's narrower and taller tires have more room under the diffs.

As for the performance in conditions, it just depends too much - what kind of snow, what kind of mud, what kind of sand, how much power do you have, how much does YOUR rig weigh, what's the weight distribution, etc. Sometimes too MUCH flotation is more of a problem than too little.

IMHO, for Colorado, tall/skinny is where it's at.

Some interesting points in this article:
http://www.expeditionswest.com/research/white_papers/tire_selection_rev1.html

[ziggy428]

Hmm...sounds like I trade off but I have chains for Ice/light snow..I'll probably go 305-295. thanks for the input. excellent article. I did find a situation where 18" is definitely the way to go. A straight six supra engine that makes over 500hp easy. not relavent but very cool. this guy gets 12 sec quarter mile times.
http://webpages.charter.net/dbcaudill/images/feb12_011.jpg
http://webpages.charter.net/dbcaudill/images/DSC_2112small.JPG
http://www.supracharged.com/other_trucks/derek/Race3.mpg

[RedRunnertc]

Yeah, that's on pavement though ... the dynamics are a lot different offroad.

http://www.school-for-champions.com/science/friction_equation.htm

[AxleIke]

Here is my opinion on tires.

Until you have a fully built buggy, running 1-2.5 ton gear, with several feet of travel, fully tubed with a big horsepower engine, tires are a complete wash. My truck will drive the same stuff no matter what brand or width of tire i have.

Get what you want. Narrower is better to fit taller, but wider is better in the situations thefatkid detailed. I recommend anything with a 3ply or better sidewall, but even there you can still have issues.

I will say that putting different width tires front to rear is a bad idea. Generally, you want the front track width to be ever so slightly wider than the rear. This helps with stability on road, and makes the truck steer correctly. You can get funky road manners with a wider rear.

[Mythica]

that drag taco is sick! I have always wanted a 2wheel drive taco to do that to but my 4wd takes all my money.


I am confussed as to why you would want dif tires sizes unless your trying to drag it though? I like taller skinny tires for wheeling. For street cars i preffer the same size tires front and rear.

I had a hot rod in high school that my dad and i built, we put big fatties on the back and pizza cutters on the front. The car was horrible on the road, we later went with the same size tire front and rear and the car handled much better.

[ziggy428]

hmm...I think different sizes could be a pain. My original purpose was to have a pair for street and trails but those types don't do squat in the mud which is fun to play in. :) so I was thinking find something as wide as possible that resembles tractor tires just to see how far one can pull through in the mud. (not for daily driving) However, I've seen some of the competition trucks get stuck in deep mud pits after like 20ft with something like 47 in tires so I guess that only gets you so far. The only thing better than that is like Mattracks or something.

[thefatkid]

I got to ride a Quad with those tracks. They are the bomb. they will take you as far or farther then a snowmobile.

[hawkonthewing]

IMHO, for Colorado, tall/skinny is where it's at.

Some interesting points in this article:
http://www.expeditionswest.com/research/white_papers/tire_selection_rev1.html
Good point, dude. But it all sounds strangely familiar........

[TowerRigger]

To the expiditions west article:

I don't consider 12.5" a wide tire. It's more just a happy medium tire. 15.5" or heck 19.5" is wide.

Question1. If you had a say 14.5 tire with large tread voids/narrow cleats wouldn't it have a similar surface presure as a narrow tire with small tread voids/narrow cleats?
Question2. Say the surface pressure is similar. Wouldn't the large tread void/narrow cleat cover more ground finding different terrain to grip?

kind of like these dashes simulating the track

Narrow tire. small tread void/small cleats

----
^^^^^^^^^^^^

Wide tire. large tread void/small cleats

- - - -
^^^^^^^^^^^^

?????

[RedRunnertc]

Question1. If you had a say 14.5 tire with large tread voids/narrow cleats wouldn't it have a similar surface presure as a narrow tire with small tread voids/narrow cleats?

Assuming a hard surface where the cleats didn't penetrate, yes, but a tire is flexible and/or the surfaces soft, so there will be more contacting.


Question2. Say the surface pressure is similar. Wouldn't the large tread void/narrow cleat cover more ground finding different terrain to grip?

Possibly, but the extra flotation (see answer above) will prevent the rubber from keying into the surface. I guess it's kinda "quality" (tire well keyed into the rough surface" vs "quantity" (a bunch of rubber not well keyed)

We could debate that all day, the fact is for a given amount of lift, you can fit a taller tire if it's narrower, and that's the only way for the diff to clear the rocks.

[hawkonthewing]

We could debate that all day, the fact is for a given amount of lift, you can fit a taller tire if it's narrower, and that's the only way for the diff to clear the rocks.

Troy, I sense a little weariness with this topic. We know it has been discussed a great deal here and there. But the thing I like about TR's comments is that he did his homework, thought about it, and brought up an interesting point. Some are prone to basing their arguments only on their own opinions and bias.

Question1. If you had a say 14.5 tire with large tread voids/narrow cleats wouldn't it have a similar surface presure as a narrow tire with small tread voids/narrow cleats?

I like Troy's response. And would say, yes, you could get the same surface area in contact with a hard surface with a narrow tire with fewer voids in the tread as a wider tire with proportionantly more voids. Equal surface area means equal lbs/sq inch which means equal friction that is related to the mechanical keying effect as discribed in the article. Of course, this is just one element of overall tire performance in a variety of conditions

Question2. Say the surface pressure is similar. Wouldn't the large tread void/narrow cleat cover more ground finding different terrain to grip?

Let's go back to the article under "Off-Highway Effects of Contact Pressure". He discusses deformation, mechanical keying, and adhesion as it relates to contact pressure. It seems to me you might have a point in the sense that if you compare a narrow tire with highway tread versus a proportionantly wider MT tread with equal contact pressure, maybe they would score the same in two of these catagories. The one I'm not sure about is deformation. I think he is saying that a narrower tire deforms more around a rock and, as a result, improves traction. If the wider tire covers two rocks (for example), the deformation would be more diffuse and more subject to shear.

Keep in mind that his premise was tall AND narrow. He is assuming that if you max tire size on a particular rig, you will be able to go taller if you don't go so wide - that these things are normally a trade off. He is saying for a lot of reasons, go tall instead of wide. That's better for traction and, as Troy pointed out, gives you more room under the pumpkin as well. And for a lot of us, that may be the bigger issue.

[TowerRigger]

I almost didn't post. I know it's been beat to death.
In the grand skeam of things I do think inches under the diff wins.
I can't help myself I love 44" boggers. Screw the science.lol

[RedRunnertc]

Troy, I sense a little weariness with this topic. We know it has been discussed a great deal here and there. But the thing I like about TR's comments is that he did his homework, thought about it, and brought up an interesting point. Some are prone to basing their arguments only on their own opinions and bias.

Well, not really weary, but as an engineer, until someone does an instrumented test, we're just basically presenting opinions and thoughts - and that's OK, I just wanted to make the point that the only FACT in the discussion is the fitment issue.

[ziggy428]

I almost didn't post. I know it's been beat to death.
In the grand skeam of things I do think inches under the diff wins.
I can't help myself I love 44" boggers. Screw the science.lol

I think I'd have to agree with you there. I think that falls under the I'd do it because I can category. Just giant monster truck tires on a little Toyota would
be ridiculously cool.

[ike]

I just went to 33x9.5's and the traction improvment over 10.5's with similar treads was signifigant in my opion after one wet and snowy run. :2cents:

[thefatkid]

Similar tread doesn't cut it. Was it the same BFG?

I have the same size only in the 10.5 if you want to comparo

The biggest difference I found is every time I get a new set of tires they seem to work better then the worn out ones I got rid of. :)

We are all right because we are that cool

[thefatkid]

44" boggers are soo last year. 52s" 56s" are the bomb now

Anyone see the TTC pics? Those trucks are huge.

[TowerRigger]

I just can't stomach them yet. 56" is too crazy. Why don't you just run rockwells with tractor tires by that time.

[hawkonthewing]

In the grand skeam of things I do think inches under the diff wins.
I can't help myself I love 44" boggers. Screw the science.lol

There's an honest man.

I just wanted to make the point that the only FACT in the discussion is the fitment issue.Point well taken.

[ziggy428]

Aren't those too big for taco axles? I think that would the tire I see all these guys have of extreme wheeling videos. They go straight up the rock hills and then one by one their u-joints go pop-pop-pop, and back down they go. I think by that time I would get myself an old M-35 truck. Those are the bomb, I've driven a 6X6 dump truck at work in mud that was knee high and didn't get stuck. And to boot one of my "redneck" co-workers decided that since we needed to move a large 20 ft trash dumpster full of sand which would have been a suck job to dig out he was going to pull it out of the way with the truck. They hooked up cables which didn't brake to my surprise. He fired up the old air force truck a got about 4 ft with the tires burning! It was just enough for the water line workers to get in. I tell you, that things a pig.

[TowerRigger]

Back home I did know a guy running 39.5 boggers on Toy axles. They broke sometimes. Not as much as you'd think for 39s, 5.29s quick lock front and rear, and 22re. But that sas'd 4runner looked hella cool. To bad my Ex wifes super douch bag brother inlaw owned it.