91' 4runner turn key build

[ScottyC]

This is what I have going on in the shop right now. Its a 1991 4runner 5spd with the 3.0L. Its getting a solid axle, 4" front, 5" rear, Detroits, 5.29s, and some sliders.

http://www.toyotaholics.com/support/files/scotty/20080223071348_PICT7315.JPG

http://www.toyotaholics.com/support/files/scotty/20080223071411_PICT7312.JPG

http://www.toyotaholics.com/support/files/scotty/20080223071431_PICT7313.JPG

http://www.toyotaholics.com/support/files/scotty/20080223071451_PICT7314.JPG

http://www.toyotaholics.com/support/files/scotty/20080223071558_PICT7318.JPG

http://www.toyotaholics.com/support/files/scotty/20080223071637_PICT7316.JPG

BTW, if anyone wants the complete IFS minus calipers for FREE come get it. You need a truck. I have a cherry picker.

[Son of Mayhem]

Why is you so far!!!!!!:D

Looks good:D

[ScottyC]

Why is you so far!!!!!!:D

Looks good:D

Please....................:rolleyes: I am one tank of gas away. Get motivated will ya! :D

[Son of Mayhem]

LOL, I drove that way once in a brand new Sedan and it felt like it took days:D

I couldn't imagine it in the 4runner.

[ScottyC]

Its 150 miles. That's it!

Ya big sissy!

[ike]

I could get it down to denver for you if you need me to.

[Quick Draw]

Another Addicted Offroad project, huh? I'm sure it will turn out awesome. Do you ever get to wheel those babies you turn out, or do you just build 'em?

[RedRunnertc]

Hmmm SAS on a second gen ... wouldn't be my choice.

[ScottyC]

Another Addicted Offroad project, huh? I'm sure it will turn out awesome. Do you ever get to wheel those babies you turn out, or do you just build 'em?

Just building these. This is the new play toy for the shop:
http://www.toyotaholics.com/support/files/scotty/20080219134312_PICT7298.JPG

[ScottyC]

Hmmm SAS on a second gen ... wouldn't be my choice.

Its not mine. It should turn out just fine and be a hell of a wheeler.

[RedRunnertc]

For a top heavy glass laden bitch with no room to cut fenders I guess ... take it from someone who wheels one - a 2nd gen 4Runner is about the WORST choice in the Toyota inventory to make a hardcore (and if it's not hardcore, why are you SAS'ing it) rig out of...

Not directed at you Scotty - just in case someone comes across this in the future and is misled into thinking this is a good idea.

[ScottyC]

For a top heavy glass laden bitch with no room to cut fenders I guess ... take it from someone who wheels one - a 2nd gen 4Runner is about the WORST choice in the Toyota inventory to make a hardcore (and if it's not hardcore, why are you SAS'ing it) rig out of...

Not directed at you Scotty - just in case someone comes across this in the future and is misled into thinking this is a good idea.

I completely understand. But, then again, I plan to a SAS a 3rd gen fairly soon.

[Turbo4Runner]

Troy you forgot that Scotty eats IFS and poops SAS, making these projects much easier..

[Volcom]

For a top heavy glass laden bitch with no room to cut fenders I guess ... take it from someone who wheels one - a 2nd gen 4Runner is about the WORST choice in the Toyota inventory to make a hardcore (and if it's not hardcore, why are you SAS'ing it) rig out of...

Not directed at you Scotty - just in case someone comes across this in the future and is misled into thinking this is a good idea.

Some people like having the 4 doors and running 35's. Can't do that with the stock IFS setup and be reliable. Just because you don't like the 2nd gen SAS'ed 4Runner doesn't mean somebody else won't.

[ScottyC]

Some people like having the 4 doors and running 35's. Can't do that with the stock IFS setup and be reliable. Just because you don't like the 2nd gen SAS'ed 4Runner doesn't mean somebody else won't.

Personally, I think the biggest drawback of the 2nd gen 4runner is simply how underpowered they are given the weight. The 3.0 in these years is worthless, and even the 22re in such a heavy rig is worthless.

It amazing how many 90-95 4runners are on Craigslist for under $2000 with blown motors or headgasket issues. Now, if you drop a 4.3L Vortec or 3.4L into one, it may be a little different.:2cents:

[RedRunnertc]

Exactly. Swapping a third gen with a FAR superior drivetrain, or a first gen, weighing almost 500 lbs less is a much better decision IMHO.

Why do you need/want 4 doors on an extreme wheeling rig?

35's on the IFS will be fine if you do it right ... which will be tough with the rear door interfering with your ability to cut the fenders.

Keep in mind that I have TWO second gens, one of which IS SAS'd. Getting the rear suspension right with all the weight back there has been an expensive nightmare. I imagine it will be totally different when we cut the back off - ONLY then will we be able to truly 'wheel it to it's potential.

Also, you can't fit nearly as much "stuff" in a 4Runner as you can a truck - whenever we do ANY kind of "expedition" trip (like White Rim), we have to put stuff in somebody else's truck.

[ScottyC]

Exactly. Swapping a third gen with a FAR superior drivetrain, or a first gen, weighing almost 500 lbs less is a much better decision IMHO.

Why do you need/want 4 doors on an extreme wheeling rig?

35's on the IFS will be fine if you do it right ... which will be tough with the rear door interfering with your ability to cut the fenders.

Keep in mind that I have TWO second gens, one of which IS SAS'd. Getting the rear suspension right with all the weight back there has been an expensive nightmare. I imagine it will be totally different when we cut the back off - ONLY then will we be able to truly 'wheel it to it's potential.

Also, you can't fit nearly as much "stuff" in a 4Runner as you can a truck - whenever we do ANY kind of "expedition" trip (like White Rim), we have to put stuff in somebody else's truck.

I don't want a truck. I have a family that goes with me. Wife and three kids. A truck ain't gonna cut it.

Also keep in mind that I do these conversions on a regular basis, so I have been through the tricks before. I run a 1" taller spring and a 1" taller shackle in the rear to compensate for the weight of the rear. It allows it to sit level at ride height.

If I do a 3rd gen, it will likely be linked up front. I have done one before for a customer when I was still working at All-Pro. It was sick.

[Volcom]

Exactly. Swapping a third gen with a FAR superior drivetrain, or a first gen, weighing almost 500 lbs less is a much better decision IMHO.

I'm not saying that the 2nd gen is the best platform to start with but build and wheel what you've got. Try finding a 3rd gen for under $7-8K without a million miles on it, 5 speed, 3.4, etc... You could have one hell of a DD / weekend trail 2nd gen 4Runner for that kind of money and actually be built rather than rocking a stock 3rd gen.

Why do you need/want 4 doors on an extreme wheeling rig?

Why do you keep saying "Hardcore" and "Extreme"??? Nowhere in the first post does he say his customer wants a "Hardcore" or "Extreme" 2nd gen 4Runner. :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: Get over it already.

You can run 95% of the trails in CO with a rig locked on 35's (even a 2nd gen with all the glass). You may not get there quickly but who cares, just have some fun.

35's on the IFS will be fine if you do it right ... which will be tough with the rear door interfering with your ability to cut the fenders.

I've never seen an IFS rig handle 35's (unless you dump a shit ton of money into it) here in CO and enjoy those weekly alignment visits. Cut the IFS off and build it right if you plan on wheeling it on 35's.

Keep in mind that I have TWO second gens, one of which IS SAS'd. Getting the rear suspension right with all the weight back there has been an expensive nightmare. I imagine it will be totally different when we cut the back off - ONLY then will we be able to truly 'wheel it to it's potential.

Yeah, we ALL know you have 2nd gen 4Runners. What's so hard with cutting out the coils and hanging a decent set of leaf springs?? Weigh the rig, add up all your camping gear, tools, and spare parts, call up Alcan and have them custom made a set of rear leaf springs for $400.

How much more potential do you need out of Molly's rig??? Seems like it does just fine for the types of trails you run with it.

Also, you can't fit nearly as much "stuff" in a 4Runner as you can a truck - whenever we do ANY kind of "expedition" trip (like White Rim), we have to put stuff in somebody else's truck.

First it's "Hardcore" and "Extreme", now it's "expedition"?? You can't have a rig that will fit all these needs. IMHO, a 2nd gen 4Runner, SAS'ed on 35's would be a great medium between "Extreme" and "expedition".

[thefatkid]

Troy, the key is not not buy off the shelf springs, or use springs that are not matched for the weight. The back of a truck weighs around 1500lbs, my fatty runner weighs 2200lbs empty. I don't have a clue what your fat runner weighs, 2800lbs would be my guess. A set of springs designed to haul the load will perform better (less flex though) in off camber situations.

As for the rear door cutting, it sucks. One option is to extend the wheelbase in the rear to about 110" and then you have room for 40s with cutting and tubbing.

I would not build a 2nd or 3rd extream. Why beat the piss out of the more expensive truck. When I was into rockrigs I was only getting 2 years out of a body. I'm sure most of the SAS rigs that are out there could have acomplished the same thing if they were IFS (SAS is trendy though for most mild wheelers).

ScottyC your work looks great and that guy will be happy. I like that you pay attention to the details and completly "chop" the IFS off. I like the "truck" look/grill of the pre 92 rigs.

[thefatkid]

Yeah, we ALL know you have 2nd gen 4Runners. What's so hard with cutting out the coils and hanging a decent set of leaf springs?? Weigh the rig, add up all your camping gear, tools, and spare parts, call up Alcan and have them custom made a set of rear leaf springs for $400.



Alcans are running about 600 for a "builder pack". Mine are 62" spring under, setup for 2600lbs. They are good and stiff at ride height. Total travel is about 16" from bump to droop, I have to limit to 14" though because I'm too much of a puss to cut into the cabin for the shocks.

Edit: cutting the rear of that coil setup is sooo much harder then the front. It took 8 hours of cutting and grinding, the front SAS runs around 3 hours for me (cleanup only).

[Volcom]

Alcans are running about 600 for a "builder pack". Mine are 62" spring under, setup for 2600lbs. They are good and stiff at ride height. Total travel is about 16" from bump to droop, I have to limit to 14" though because I'm too much of a puss to cut into the cabin for the shocks.

Edit: cutting the rear of that coil setup is sooo much harder then the front. It took 8 hours of cutting and grinding, the front SAS runs around 3 hours for me (cleanup only).

Right on, thanks for the price update. Still sounds like a deal when talking about the rear suspension of the 2nd and even the 3rd gen 4Runners.

I'll be cutting holes for my shocks also :saw:

[AxleIke]

I don't think troy was attacking scotty at all. The guy is just doing a job for another person.

I'm sure Scotty will do an excellent job, as, judging from the other builds I've seen, his work is top notch.

Since I didn't put any negative in, i'll join the club! :D

Personally, I'm just against SAS's across the board. Doesn't really matter what truck they are on.

Too many stupid assholes who can't drive got em. Then they give you that look when you show up to the trail head and start airing down, like "you have no business here". Can't stand it, smug bastards. Then they get on the net and spread their wealth of ignorance, and you get a whole bunch of newbs all confused.

There. All negative'd out. Back to the happy fun guy!!!

Now, wheres that "I'm in the closet" group hug emoticon?!?!! :flipoff4:

[ScottyC]

I don't think troy was attacking scotty at all. The guy is just doing a job for another person.

I'm sure Scotty will do an excellent job, as, judging from the other builds I've seen, his work is top notch.

Since I didn't put any negative in, i'll join the club! :D

Personally, I'm just against SAS's across the board. Doesn't really matter what truck they are on.

Too many stupid assholes who can't drive got em. Then they give you that look when you show up to the trail head and start airing down, like "you have no business here". Can't stand it, smug bastards. Then they get on the net and spread their wealth of ignorance, and you get a whole bunch of newbs all confused.

There. All negative'd out. Back to the happy fun guy!!!

Now, wheres that "I'm in the closet" group hug emoticon?!?!! :flipoff4:

Sure beats lifting tires on the trail every 30 feet though. :D

I don't taken offense at all. But, this is what I do for a living, and when a customer wants something done, its not like I am going to talk him out of it. The purpose of this rig is strictly a moderate offroad capable rigs. Its getting 5.29s, 35s, and Detroits.

I will say this though. All of the guys that dumped a ton of $$$ into their IFS all tell me the same thing when we talk about a solid axle. "I wish I would have done it right the first time and saved the $$$."

I've learned my lessons in the past from the rigs I have built. I don't waste time with an IFS if the purpose is going to be for Rockcrawling. However, there will always be a place for a nicely built rig on 33s with an IFS front and Elocker rear. It will get you to 95% of where you want to go.

As far as all the SAS guys being A-holes. Well, I'd rather wheel with a nice guy in a Geo, than a dickhead in a Toyota. Regardless of whether it has a solid axle, IFS, or whatever. Shit, it can be a 2wd for all I care. :D

[AxleIke]

No joke. Nice guys all the way!!!

My beef isn't with people wanting to avoid spending money twice, its with people who go straight from purchased and hardly wheeled to SAS, and never learn how to even get in the dirt first, simply because some guy on the net or their buddy with an F-350 told them too.

People on their 2nd or 3rd build are in a completely different league. They've learned it all, and are building it right the first time, not screwing around. TheFatkid is a good example. Dudes had shitloads of trucks, and now has a truck he likes, that does what he wants.

Anyway, enough cluttering the thread. I look forward to seeing the finished truck. Are you going to put on any armor, or is that happening somewhere else?

[ScottyC]

No joke. Nice guys all the way!!!

My beef isn't with people wanting to avoid spending money twice, its with people who go straight from purchased and hardly wheeled to SAS, and never learn how to even get in the dirt first, simply because some guy on the net or their buddy with an F-350 told them too.

People on their 2nd or 3rd build are in a completely different league. They've learned it all, and are building it right the first time, not screwing around. TheFatkid is a good example. Dudes had shitloads of trucks, and now has a truck he likes, that does what he wants.

Anyway, enough cluttering the thread. I look forward to seeing the finished truck. Are you going to put on any armor, or is that happening somewhere else?

Just sliders for now. I should have worked on it today, but have been laid up with the flu. Hopefully tomorrow.

[ScottyC]

BTW, just to go way off topic. Not all my rigs are Yotas either. This is my newest current rig:
http://www.toyotaholics.com/support/files/scotty/20080219134312_PICT7298.JPG

Talk about a lot of sheet metal and being overweight! :D :eek:

At least it will hold the whole family, the dogs, and all my camping gear. I might even be able to tow a rig on a trailer behind it! :D

[AxleIke]

Everything you build is so shiny!!!

Its like man-jewlery.

EDIT: (and some woman jewlery too)

[RedRunnertc]

First, Molly's rig HAS heavy duty leaves in the rear (63" chevy's). Extending the wheelbase would be a huge help. As will be cutting off all that weight in the back...

To clarify my other statements, IMHO, the ONLY reason to SAS is to have an extreme/hardcore rockcrawling rig, because locked front/rear on 33's, even with IFS, will take you anywhere you want to go that you still care about the body/glass. The "early" IFS holds up just fine on my rig (and AxleIke's now that he dialed the lift out). The key is to keep it stock height - the more lift on it, the more problems.

I think the work Scotty does is great, and if someone wants to pay him to do a SAS, why should he refuse - that's just bad business. So, he'll build a helluva SFA rig that will work great, and the owner will have a ton of fun beating the hell out of it on the trails it's capable of running.

Scotty - my 2 cents - wife + 3 kids + 2nd gen 4Runner + ANY overnight trip = need a trailer

This is just my opinion based on my experience with 2 different 2nd gen 4Runner builds, everyone is entitled to theirs.

[ScottyC]

Everything you build is so shiny!!!

Its like man-jewlery.

EDIT: (and some woman jewlery too)

I need some bling on the wheels though. The Black Rockcrawlers just aren't cutting it on this one. I want some Centerline Hellcats in the 15x10 variety.

[ScottyC]

First, Molly's rig HAS heavy duty leaves in the rear (63" chevy's). Extending the wheelbase would be a huge help. As will be cutting off all that weight in the back...

To clarify my other statements, IMHO, the ONLY reason to SAS is to have an extreme/hardcore rockcrawling rig, because locked front/rear on 33's, even with IFS, will take you anywhere you want to go that you still care about the body/glass. The "early" IFS holds up just fine on my rig (and AxleIke's now that he dialed the lift out). The key is to keep it stock height - the more lift on it, the more problems.

I think the work Scotty does is great, and if someone wants to pay him to do a SAS, why should he refuse - that's just bad business. So, he'll build a helluva SFA rig that will work great, and the owner will have a ton of fun beating the hell out of it on the trails it's capable of running.

Scotty - my 2 cents - wife + 3 kids + 2nd gen 4Runner + ANY overnight trip = need a trailer

This is just my opinion based on my experience with 2 different 2nd gen 4Runner builds, everyone is entitled to theirs.

Yes, but 3rd gen 4runner + 3 kids + wife + overnight trip = Tent trailer. :welder:

I have done numerous Rubicon and Dusy Ershim trips while living in CA where I would spend 3-4 days on the trail. You have to pack everything into the trail and then pack it up every morning into your rig and move on. All of them were done in a built CJ7 or Built Early Bronco. We packed for two people on those runs, but the rear of the Jeep has LESS room than my 1st gen 4runner has behind the seats. I have no doubt that I could swing a 3-4 days trip with my family in a 3rd gen. The Blazer on the other hand. Hell, I could take the dogs too. :D

[Lysmachia]

I think Troy and I must camp like royalty. LOL Because seriously with all the trail tools we take and spare parts and food and camping gear, well... And danged with my 35 tire in the back it is so hard to keep the weight low down on the floor.

LOL - I think what troy was trying in the end to say, and I will echo.. if we both had it all do to over again we'd have Taco's and not 4 runners. LOL but we don't have family and that is the big difference right there!

Scotty you do great work. Would love to meet you some time.

[ScottyC]

OK, since I have been sick for the last 11 days. [xx(]
Its about time this rig is almost done. The SAS and rear kit are done and I drove it tonight without any issues. The owner (JGrund) is picking it up tonight, but still needs to bring it back for me to finish a couple more mods on it. For now she is driving around Greeley
until next week.

http://www.toyotaholics.com/support/files/scotty/20080307173220_PICT7359.JPG

http://www.toyotaholics.com/support/files/scotty/20080307173300_PICT7356.JPG

http://www.toyotaholics.com/support/files/scotty/20080307173320_PICT7357.JPG

http://www.toyotaholics.com/support/files/scotty/20080307173447_PICT7360.JPG

http://www.toyotaholics.com/support/files/scotty/20080307173508_PICT7355.JPG

http://www.toyotaholics.com/support/files/scotty/20080307173737_JGrund.jpg

[AxleIke]

Looks good.

I saw on YT that he plans on going with 35's.

However, I really like those pics, as it shows that the truck would look BAD with 9.50's and 3" springs. That would be AWESOME.

[jarboarder1]

It looks real good man. I'm excited to see it with new tires.

[Lysmachia]

So are you saying you did this build for a new she wheeler? (JGrund) YES! We need more lady wheelers! Tell her to sign up!

Rig looks great. Is that a flat black paint job? I think it looks pretty cool!

[ScottyC]

So are you saying you did this build for a new she wheeler? (JGrund) YES! We need more lady wheelers! Tell her to sign up!

Rig looks great. Is that a flat black paint job? I think it looks pretty cool!

J stands for "Josh"...............Sorry. :D