no more bilsteins, what else???

3512 Views 47 Replies 14 Participants Last post by hytenor, Mar 14, 2005

ocdp2000

Discussion Starter · Jan 17, 2005

ok it seems like everyone is out of bils and it over a month wait just to possibly get some. is there any shock comperable to a bilstein that maybe isnt as pricey. ive searched the forum and all everyone says is bilstein HDs which is nice, but how about us peeps that cant get a hold of any. my lift kit is waiting on rear shocks and i cant wait any longer, so what shock would be close to a Bilstein and not a load of cash to get???? i have a 2" AAL in the rear any my truck is a 2002 prerunner v6.
any help would rule.
thanks
-darren

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hytenor

· #11 · Jan 18, 2005

wisctaco04 said:
I was looking into another setup and will part with my 5150's. They have about 3K on them and are in excellent condition. I have 3.5" lift and they are a tad long for my setup. For 2" lift you will bottom them out but if you go 3.5" they are ok unless you fully load the bed lift one wheel into the well. Check out my link for a pic. That is the running height at 3.5" lift in the pix.

what are the pt#s on those?

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hytenor

· #13 · Jan 18, 2005

here are the part#s and specs for the 5150s: $200ea.
Part Number Travel Description Valving Reservoir Ext Length Col Length Shaft
Dia Mounting
BF5-A194-H1 6.48 5150 Crossflow 255/70 Attached 18.78 12.30 14mm eye/eye
BF5-A195-H1 8.33 5150 Crossflow 255/70 Attached 22.50 14.17 14mm eye/eye
BF5-A196-H0 10.02 5150 Crossflow 170/60 Attached 25.91 15.89 14mm eye/eye
BF5-A196-H1 10.02 5150 Crossflow 255/70 Attached 25.91 15.89 14mm eye/eye
BF5-A197-H0 11.50 5150 Crossflow 170/60 Attached 27.99 16.50 14mm eye/eye
BF5-A187-H0 11.93 5150 Crossflow 170/60 Attached 29.70 17.78 14mm eye/eye
BF5-A187-H1 11.93 5150 Crossflow 255/70 Attached 29.70 17.78 14mm eye/eye
BF5-A198-H0 14.53 5150 Crossflow 170/60 Attached 34.90 20.37 14mm eye/eye
BF5-A198-H1 14.53 5150 Crossflow 255/70 Attached 34.90 20.37 14mm eye/eye

Stock is 6", I believe so the 8.33" model whould work for a 2" lift.
past that you'll need over 4.5" for the next size up or you can bottom them out and possibly snap off a shock mount...not good.

These shocks are great, I run them, but their sizes are very limited.
It is also suggested to run the lighter valving (170/60) and the choices are even more limited. I have the 196 and 197 HOs with 4.5" of rear lift. The driver's side shock is still a tad too long.

Another possibility is the 5125s: not sure on price
Part Number Travel Description Valving Reservoir Ext Length Col Length Shaft
Dia Mounting
BE5-6251-H5 6.63 5125 Off-Road 255/70 N/A 18.50 12.03 14mm eye/eye
BE5-6252-H5 8.13 5125 Off-Road 255/70 N/A 21.54 13.58 14mm eye/eye
BE5-6253-H5 8.60 5125 Off-Road 255/70 N/A 22.50 14.06 14mm eye/eye
BE5-A463-H5 9.24 5125 Off-Road 255/70 N/A 24.35 15.11 14mm eye/eye
BE5-A464-H5 10.17 5125 Off-Road 170/60 N/A 25.93 15.91 14mm eye/eye
BE5-6248-H5 10.17 5125 Off-Road 255/70 N/A 25.93 15.91 14mm eye/eye
BE5-A465-H5 11.00 5125 Off-Road 170/60 N/A 28.01 17.00 14mm eye/eye
BE5-A465-H7 11.00 5125 Off-Road 255/70 N/A 28.01 17.00 14mm eye/eye
BE5-6249-H5 11.94 5125 Off-Road 255/70 N/A 29.70 17.91 14mm eye/eye

but, again, they have a limited selection in the lighter valved units. However, for a 2 or 3" lift, you at least have more sizes.

Try posting the question to 5125 owners too.

OME N85s are $212/pr new.

you might also look into Rancho's 9000 series adjustables...stay away from the 5000s

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hytenor

· #15 · Jan 18, 2005

wisctaco04 said:
Damnit, I knew someone would ask. I will look tomorrow. I have the receipt in the garage but it's in a pile some where. I think they are the 197HO 28"/16.5"lengths.

if they are the 197s then they are WAY too long for 3" of lift. Even at 4.5" the 196 that I have is a tad too long. The 197 on the pass side is fine, however.

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hytenor

· #17 · Jan 18, 2005

wisctaco04 said:
Yup. I run 3.5" and it will bottom out with a load. I run trails empty and am cautious as to not get crazy with them. They did do a piss poor job with the various sizes. It was either too short or too long. I wanted the full extension since a good bumpstop over stock can stop the bottoming out. We will have to see how the new Donahoe shocks do for the travel dilema. It sounds like they will cover the in between sizes. I am going the shock relocation route soon so all this should be a moot point for me hopefully.

I'm very happy with these but will be interested in how the new Hoes perform. I don't worry about bottom out when I'm not loaded with these NWOR hd springs but when I've got 2000' of wood back there I really have to watch it. As for extension, I modded these leafpks and managed to just barely top them out at full droop.

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hytenor

· #25 · Jan 19, 2005

ocdp2000 said:
ok, i got a fabtech AAL, and getting the OME shocks will be ok right? just on the ordering the page it says "OME N94 Rear Shock Set for Above Leaf Springs" i guess thats what i need right, its not only for an OME setup is it?? i can use it with my fabtech AAL?? i just got a little confused with the "above the leaf springs" because i m new to the lift game and wanna make sure i can use these. i got 2" AAL in the rear, are these the right size too for me??
sorry for so many questions, i just hate ordering the wrong stuff and having to return things.
thanks again, this is the last time.hahaa

the OME shocks are meant for a 2" lift so you'll be fine. However, you will need a BPV (brake proportioning valve) extension bracket and a longer rear brake line.

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hytenor

· #30 · Jan 19, 2005

ocdp2000 said:
the list goes on for things ill need. which ones do i need and how do i get a hold of them, can i pick them up at pep boys or is this another online order. if anyone knows which ones i need for my 2002 prerunner (part number or anything ) and where i can get some in Southern california or online please help.
thanks endlessly
-darren

wheelers has both but you can make a bracket for a couple of bucks if you have a drill
for the brake line, get a 24" one. I think Wheeler's is only 18" which is fine for a 2" lift but we never have enough lift, so...

http://www.xtremecrawlers.com/
http://www.norcalttora.com/~chris/mods/BPV/photos/photo_3.html

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hytenor

· #34 · Jan 19, 2005

peekay331 said:
just for everyone's info,

i have the 8.3" travel 5150's with my alcan 3" lift leafs, which are hard as hell. on my last trip to utah, i bottomed out several times and finally the driver's side shock broke right at the eyelet (the one where you have to bolt on and locktite).

when i came home, i got another set from david v. put them on, and a few days later the upper shock mount broke off on the street.

moral of the story, the shock on the driver side was TOO LONG without longer bumpstops. i have since installed longer bumpstops but have not had the opportunity to see if they are long enough.

wow, that sucks. I'm surprised they bottomed out with 3" of lift; those springs must have great flex.

Where did you find longer bumpstops?

the moral of the story...get measurements before you order...and write them correctly (unlike me).

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hytenor

· #35 · Jan 19, 2005

cb77DEMELLO said:
I don't know if anyone has said it but 5150's are out from bilstien. the 5100's are still on back oder.

So, what is going on with Bilstein?? Are they just discontinuing shocks for Tacomas? It sounds like they have some major issues to solve.

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hytenor

· #38 · Jan 20, 2005

DylanDr said:
Here is the deal on shock length!

The compressed length of the shock is determined by bump stop position!
Any amount of lift via leaf spring or shackle DOES NOT change bump stop position so you can not run a longer compressed length without the possibility of bottoming the shock before the bump stops.
Up till now the best shock available was the Bilstien 5100 series 6252 for the left and 6253 for the right. As you know this shock is on national back order.
This is still not the Perfect shock for the application just the best so far. These are NOT “Tacoma” specific shocks, they are general application off road shocks. The compressed length of this shock is still a little to long, you can bottom out these shocks if you get into the bump stops hard. Also the valving although good, has some room for improvement. In addition the advertised #’s on length and travel are off a little, they are a little longer compressed (making bottom out worse) and have a little less travel, the extended lengths are correct though.

So
Hears the deal, we needed to make a shock that is shorter compressed so that it doesn’t bottom out, but when you make it shorter you also loose travel and you loose extended length limiting the droop of the suspension(look at the stock shocks, they hardly have any travel)
The solution:
By making a remote reservoir shock we can take the nitrogen chamber out of the main body of the shock and put it in the reservoir. This gives us more room inside the shock for a longer shaft, we can now regain the lost travel AND add some additional travel! The result is a shock that doesn’t bottom out AND has more suspension droop and travel. Plus with the reservoir you have more heat capacity to drive the shock harder without fade, and you are cooler than your friends because you have reservoir shocks! This is as good as it gets in the stock mounts!!!!!!!!

I am fine tuning the valving today and we are starting production on them Friday. They should be available to ship in about 6 weeks. They will also feature nitro steel shafts and clear power coated body for corrosion resistance and a stainless braided reservoir hose!

P.S.
If you are going to use something else DO NOT go longer than a 6252 and 6253 on the compressed length unless you are using a block.
L= 13.6 compressed (6252)
R= 14.1 compressed (6253)
Remember these can still bottom out if you drive them hard.

Ok, so something similar to the 5150s?

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hytenor

· #40 · Jan 20, 2005

ocdp2000 said:
ok ok one last question, i think im going to change out my original Bils that came with my truck in the front, they have 50k miles on them now since im getting a spacer lift in the front this would be the perfect time right??? Can i also get the OME shocks for the front for my truck as well??? or are those just for the coilover kits?? im doing the 3inch spacer lift with them so is this ok???lastly should i get the softer rides for the front too or should i get the stiffer ones?? im never going to add a winch or anything else to the front. which ones do you recommend or can i run them at all??

OME shocks are designed to go with OME coils. they are not an adjustable coilover system like Sway Away or Donahoe. We technically have a "coilover" type front suspension (the coil goes over the shock) but when you see the term posted here it is usually refering to the adjustables.

If you want to replace your front shocks and plan on keeping your stock coils, just get some of the aftermarket HD Bilsteins. any of the suppliers that have previously been mentioned will know which part # you need.

A spacer lift will give a rought ride; that's the way it goes. Using "softer" shocks won't change that.

If you want a better ride with just coils and shocks (non-adjustable), look at the OME 881s or 882s and N91s shocks. these two coils offer about 1.5" and 2.5" respectively, after settling. Adding spacers to the 881 is "ok" up to 1" or so but spacers are not recommended with the 882s as they become over preloaded and sag fast.

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hytenor

· #43 · Jan 20, 2005

DylanDr said:
NO

5150's are to long and will bottom, plus they do not have a shorter one for the left side causing that side to bottom even worse.
they do not take advantage of the space savings of a reservior to give more travel
and although the valving #'s are the same @ a spesific shaft speed, the overall tune is not as good

anyone that is using these shocks that are to long and not bottoming them out either has lift blocks or drives like an old lady

I'm a little confused since they do have an external rez. the lighter 170/60 valving that I got mine in is so much better than what I had before, the truck rides better than my wife's RAV4. Ride and handling is great whether empty or hauling 2000# of firewood.
but yes, my main complaint is that they don't come in 1" size incriments to work on the Tacomas.

and having nwor's hd rear springs and 1/5" shackles helps to keep from bottoming them out...of course they don't flex much

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hytenor

· #44 · Jan 20, 2005

ocdp2000 said:
so then your saying that i should just keep my stock bils on my truck then?? since it wont really change my ride at all id just be wasting my money then right?? im going to be offroading about 6 times a year probably and real moderate stuff since i got a prerunner. would you recommend i just keep the stock ones, bils are a good shock and i think since this truck has never been offroaded maybe i should just keep this shock in and put my toytec spacer lift in?? does that sound like a good idea?? sorry for asking so many questions.
-darren

spacer lifts will ride rough, period. If you don't mind it, it's a cheap way to get a front lift. At your current mileage you might as well replace the shocks while you install the spacers. If, at a later date, you decide to pull your OE coils and spacers you can replace them with some OME 881s for better ride/handling but still retain the new hd Bilsteins.

OE shocks are usually only good for 20k or so.

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hytenor

· #48 · Mar 14, 2005

Alan11116 said:
I have the same shocks with the OME springs and don't think they get enough droop when the other wheel pushes up into the wheel well. Have you noticed this?

whom are you addressing?

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