[Renaud33]

Has anyone tried pulling their pre-Tacoma rig behind a Tacoma with the V6 using a tow bar? If you have how well or not so well did your Tacoma handle it?

I am hesitant to try this with my 85' Runner on 35's. It would probably look silly.

 

[Pink Taco]

it could probably do it. i'd make sure to disconnect my driveshafts though.

 

[Renaud33]

it could probably do it. i'd make sure to disconnect my driveshafts though.

I too am guessing it could do it. I would think it would be ok on flat ground. Definately don't want to try it going thru the mountains. Would hate to burn up my clutch or kill the tranny. I would definately disconnect my driveshafts. Hopefully someone has tried this. I am guessing my 4Runner weighs around 3,750 lbs.

 

[Murderman]

The biggest problem is going to be the lack of brakes.

 

[Renaud33]

The biggest problem is going to be the lack of brakes.

Is there an upgrade that would help out any? I just put new rotors and pads on a year and a half ago.

 

[Murderman]

If you are flat towing, you basically have twice the weight, but no increase in braking capacity like when trailering [with trailer brakes]. You also have to be careful to keep from having the towed rig push the ass end of the tow rig around when trying to turn. Personally, I am not a big fan of flat towing.

 

[Renaud33]

Personally, I am not a big fan of flat towing.

Me either but I am not so sure I want to drive my Runner more then an hour or two. I can't afford a trailer and full size truck.

 

[98 Taco]

get yourself a flat trailer
I am going that route to tow my tacoma

 

[Renaud33]

get yourself a flat trailer
I am going that route to tow my tacoma

Wow, your really stepping things up. I noticed your post about doing a SAS. You need to bring that SAS Taco down to Make it or Break it. You can go with me as a guest. Bring other members as well.

I have a few things I will be adding to my Runner this spring. Rear tube bumper, rear lincoln lock, and perhaps 4.7 T-case gears.

Been working on trimming my fenders. The welding of the new inners is completed now its basically finishing work.

Kurt

 

[Murderman]

and perhaps 4.7 T-case gears.

Kurt

I installed some 4.7's in my trail rig a few months back, and they are a day and night difference over the 2.28's. I work the rig alot less getting up ledges, and actually have compression braking now, which makes downhills alot less scary. One downside is that I do a fair amount of shifting between lo-3rd and hi-1st to maintain reasonable speed between obstacles. The other consideration is that if I hadn't upgraded the front brakes at the same time, it would be hard to hold the rig still while in gear.

 

[Renaud33]

I installed some 4.7's in my trail rig a few months back, and they are a day and night difference over the 2.28's. I work the rig alot less getting up ledges, and actually have compression braking now, which makes downhills alot less scary. One downside is that I do a fair amount of shifting between lo-3rd and hi-1st to maintain reasonable speed between obstacles. The other consideration is that if I hadn't upgraded the front brakes at the same time, it would be hard to hold the rig still while in gear.

Doesn't suprise me that its night and day difference. I have an exta T-case so if I don't like it I can swap the 2.28 case back in. Did you do the work yourself? I am far from a mechanic but I am thinking I can do this with a little help from a friend. (if need be)

You mention going from lo-3rd to hi-1st. Isn't that somewhat difficult to do? I guess I was thinking I would be shifting all the time in 4 low. Maybe using low-5 in some cases.

What kind of front upgrade did you do? IFS calipers and FJ rotors?

 

[Murderman]

If you already have a spare xfer, wouldn't a crawler be an option worth considering for just a little more $$$? It wasn't for me with a 97" WB and my engine placement [the rear driveshaft would be really short], but it would seem to have more flexibility for you; that way you could have both 2.28 and 5.20 ratios available.

I installed the gears myself, just like everything else on my rig. For an average mechanic, I would say it is not that big a deal. You might as well also put twin sticks in while you have the case apart; they are a godsend with a front auto locker.

My shift patterns are substantially different than yours would be since I am running a 3-speed automatic [see John Anderson under Member's Rigs for complete vehicle specs]. Lo-3rd is 19.27 CR with my 4.10's, and that is too slow when trying to travel any significant distance, so I must shift to hi. Your OD might be OK in low, depending on your diff ratios.

I have been shifting my early Toyo gear xfer from low to high and vice versa while rolling [at reasonable speeds] for 20 years without much problem. When I used to have a 5-speed manual, I would just dump the clutch, shift two tranny gears [up or down as appropriate] and let her fly. With the auto, I shift to tranny neutral, quickly hit the xfer, and then grab the appropriate tranny gear. It is a little harder to avoid grinding with an auto, and definitely harder with the 4.7's, but manageable. The gear xfer seems to be a little more tolerant than the chain case in my old Taco was, but even that wasn't bad with a 5-speed; maybe I just had alot more practice with the gear case.

The brake upgrade was the standard IFS V-6 [4 big pistons] calipers and FJ rotors. It made a big improvement, particularly with my relatively large rear disks; definitely worth the price of admission, and completely bolt-on [except the calipers may need to be clearanced depending on you wheels]. I would highly recommend this mod.

Let me know if you care to discuss the details of any of this further; I have been running Toyo 8" axles and gear xfer in various configurations of my rig for 20 years.

 

[Renaud33]

If you already have a spare xfer, wouldn't a crawler be an option worth considering for just a little more $$$? It wasn't for me with a 97" WB and my engine placement [the rear driveshaft would be really short], but it would seem to have more flexibility for you; that way you could have both 2.28 and 5.20 ratios available.

I have considered other options but, I just finished up my rig in November. I just spent $500 plus on High Angle Driveline driveshafts. I have some other big purchases I need to make as well. Yes I eventually want to go to a dual case setup. When I started doing the calculations this is what I came up with.

1. Duals with 4.7 gears. $1,250 and this doesn't include shipping.
$400 for gears, $500 for adapter, $200 for Xmember, $150 for ds work

2. Duals with 2.28 $850 same as above minus $400

3. 4.7 gears. $450

Bones from Pirate4x4) really suggested that I simply go with 4.7 gears since I have the xtra transfer case. This way I could put 4.7 gears in it and only have to swap T-cases. Could be done for about $450. This alone would double my 4low gear ratio. I think this alone will make a big difference. I live in Iowa where there aren't many rocks to crawl on. Is my thinking out of whack?

Kurt

 

[Bones]

You know my $0.02 cents already. I had 2.28/4.0 and 5.29's and it was to slow for around here. In Moab it was good, but that's once in a blue moon for me. Even with that I used the 4.0 case 90% of the time anyway. I'm not hardcore though either, just a shitty driver.

Oh and flattowing with the taco is not a good idea for the braking mentioned. Also the weight you are towing is near that of the "tow rig". and you could get into sticky situations if the vehicle in tow starts to wag. If you rented a dolly and it had surge brakes would help. FWIW I flat towed a stock FJ40 on flat ground with a 2.4 Taco for 3 miles at 25 mph max is it was not pretty.

Just drive it, it's a Toyota for gods sake!

 

[Murderman]

I have considered other options but, I just finished up my rig in November. I just spent $500 plus on High Angle Driveline driveshafts. I have some other big purchases I need to make as well. Yes I eventually want to go to a dual case setup. When I started doing the calculations this is what I came up with.

1. Duals with 4.7 gears. $1,250 and this doesn't include shipping.
$400 for gears, $500 for adapter, $200 for Xmember, $150 for ds work

2. Duals with 2.28 $850 same as above minus $400

3. 4.7 gears. $450

Bones from Pirate4x4) really suggested that I simply go with 4.7 gears since I have the xtra transfer case. This way I could put 4.7 gears in it and only have to swap T-cases. Could be done for about $450. This alone would double my 4low gear ratio. I think this alone will make a big difference. I live in Iowa where there aren't many rocks to crawl on. Is my thinking out of whack?

Kurt

Kurt, your thinking is quite clear, but your math may be just a tad out of whack.

The 4.7 gears are $450, relatively easy install, big improvement, done deal.

For the crawler, all you need from Marlin is the adapter at $500 since you already have the other case. Add $150 for the driveshaft mods, and whatever you think it will take for the crossmember buy/build depending on you fab skills....$200 max. IMHO, 2.28/4.7 is overkill, although others may disagree.

For the extra say $400 which may or may not be a big deal to you, you get the flexibility of 2.28/5.20. I am very happy with my 4.7's, but certainly would not complain about having the option. The difference is that I have 300 ft-lbs of torque, and was actually pretty happy with the 2.28's for a long time....until I learned better.

The only down side to using the dual cases with the stock gears is that they are not as strong as Marlin's improved design 4.7's. I snapped a 21-spline input about 11 years ago; the point on the shaft where it failed is significantly beefed up with the 4.7's. May or may not be an issue with you....I was rolling backwards down a hill with 38's, and slammed drive when I took it out.

Add $200 for the twin sticks either way; trust me they are worth putting in while you have the xfer out and disassembled. It is sort of like putting a locker when changing diff ratios, you might as well. There is no delta $$$ between the two options for this feature.

Either way, I don't think that you will be displeased with the results.

Cheers, John

 

[Bones]

Twin sticks are NOT worth the $200. I have used them and found them worthless when it does nothing advantagous like disconnect the front or rear driveline like an Atlas or D300. Just more shifter to mess with.

Save the $200 and put it to better use.

 

[Murderman]

Twin sticks are NOT worth the $200. I have used them and found them worthless when it does nothing advantagous like disconnect the front or rear driveline like an Atlas or D300. Just more shifter to mess with.

Save the $200 and put it to better use.

I disagree completely, Mr. Bones. True, they don't offer the functionality of front 2 only in a Toyo case like with an AII or D300 twin stick, but they are way better than nothing. I spend lots of time in 2lo, and quite often shift out of 4 on downhills just before corners. What kind of front locker are you running?

BTW, they do disconnect the front driveline....<it does nothing advantagous like disconnect the front or rear driveline >...your words, not mine.

Regards, John

 

[Bones]

I hear what you are saying but for $200 you could have ubgraded to an ARB and been better off IMO. You can also use the stock shifter and grind on the shift forks to make the shift pattern so it can be used to disco the front, but it's kinda ghetto. TNToy did this on PBB a couple years back.

To each his own, can't all have the same rigs.

I ran an ARB and dual ult cases. Had to part out my rig and won't be back into wheeling for at least another year, probably longer

 

[Murderman]

Bones, for the record, I don't consider a front ARB an "upgrade"...they leak, and that switch that they require is analagous to my xfer action from a KISS driving approach. With the Detroit, the twin sticks are well worth the $200.

Ghetto is simply that...unreliable.

I am sorry to hear that you are temporarily rigless; you will get back on the trail soon enough.

 

[equin]

Are you talking about flat-towing the early Toy using a towbar? I have to agree with 98Taco's advice - tow it on a trailer if you can. My 2.7L ext cab Prerunner towed a 47 CJ2A flatfender with a towbar for about 2 miles. It had no trouble stopping or pulling. The trouble was with the little Jeep - the front wheels kept turning left, even after I tried to tie the steering wheel. At one point the problem almost caused me to jack-knife. Luckily, I was only going about 5 mph at the time. Next time I'll put the Jeep on a trailer.

If you decide to flat-tow it, though, you might want to test it out at first to make sure you don't experience the same problem I had. Just go real slow and test out some 90 degree turns to make sure it tracks well. Also, disconnecting the driveshafts might be a good idea if you insist on flat-towing it. Oh, and if you have an auto tranny, turn the overdrive off.