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Discussion Starter #1 (Edited)
4wd TRD Tundra Coils as 2.5" Tacoma Lift?

Basically it involves using stock 4wd Tundra TRD coils ($120-$220) with either Tundra 2WD Red TRD Bilstein or Old Man Emu N91S struts, and small topout spacers to lift the front end. Looks very intriguing to me: seems like the YotaTech Tacos ended up with 2.25" of lift. The consensus on that board from the 4runner guys is that it rides very well.

Summary: http://fastq.com/~sschaefer/Tundra_Coils.html

Link: http://www.yotatech.com/showthread.php?t=41848&page=1

This seems like a very interesting and AFFORDABLE option....I am surprised I can't find any reference to it on here or the old board....

(is it possible to edit thread names? I wanted to make it more interesting so people would read it...oh well..)
 

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JonnyOzero3 said:
Basically it involves using stock 4wd Tundra TRD coils ($120-$220) with either Tundra 2WD Red TRD Bilstein or Old Man Emu N91S struts, and small topout spacers to lift the front end. Looks very intriguing to me: seems like the YotaTech Tacos ended up with 2.25" of lift. The consensus on that board from the 4runner guys is that it rides very well.

Summary: http://fastq.com/~sschaefer/Tundra_Coils.html

Link: http://www.yotatech.com/showthread.php?t=41848&page=1

This seems like a very interesting and AFFORDABLE option....I am surprised I can't find any reference to it on here or the old board....

(is it possible to edit thread names? I wanted to make it more interesting so people would read it...oh well..)
its been tried.
the biggest problem is matching up the shocks for those 800# (yes, that's what they are rated) Tundra coils. The OME N91s are matched for the 880-882 coils at 500#.

Other than that, unless you have a very heavy winch/bumper and a ton of trail armor your ride will be stiff at best. I don't know how those guys come up with "rides very well", maybe its different on a heavier Runner. And, you can forget about articulation ;)
I wonder if the coils he used were from a v6 Tundra rather than the v8, hmm. If from the v6 they should be in the 650# range (according to Downey), and should work as long as you have the extra weight up front. That would explain his 7.5" of travel, not bad, he's only lost 1/2" with the stiffer coils.


One norcal member runs Downey's Tundra coilovers with the 800# coils but thats what it took to maintain lift on his Dcab with over 200# of winch/bumper and other armor. One coil has already failed and been replaced by Downey.

I have SAWs with the new Elbach 675# coils to support my extra 350# of armor up front and they may be a tad too heavy. I don't get near the articulation I used to get with the OME 882s.
 

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since you've resorted to buying yourself drinks i'll chime in. i worked with this young guy (early 20's) who had a 96 tacoma with tundra coils for his lift. he raved on and on about them and i was intrigued until he told me about his FIPK which gave him like at least 20 extra horsepower. he got like two inches of lift but when i bounced on the front end to check it out........ it was like rock solid. almost no give. can't imagine what the ride was like. especially with all that horsepower from the FIPK.
 

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[his FIPK which gave him like at least 20 extra horsepower. [/QUOTE]

yea, right, LOL he believed the advertizment ;)

I have the fipk AND a header and get maybe extra 5hp.

the two norcalers who have/have had the tundra coils both have/had stiff rides but they only went that route to support the extra weight and maintain lift, not just for lift.
 

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Schuey2002 said:
I was thinking about doing this until I read about that whole "lack of articulation" part... :eek:
check the thread on Yotatech...all 17 pgs, LOL some very interesting stuff.
It would be nice to come up with a comprensive list of spring rates for all the different applications. I know the Tacos get 4 different rates depending on engine, 2 or 4x4, and model from something like 385 for a 2.7 prerunner to 520 for a v6 dcab TRD.

It seems from reading that thread that the 4Runner coils are a tad heavier in general and that would make sense on a heavier vehicle like the Runner especially with its larger v6 and new v8. Some there have tried runner coils in their Tacos and gotten more lift than OE but I don't know which trucks they had or how they were outfitted nor what Runner the coils came of of (as there are undoubtedly different coil rates for runners just like with the Tacos)

The main poster on that thread has different rates for the Taco springs then I got from my parts guy so there is some digging to be done on the issue.

the next time I'm at the dealership I'll ask the parts guru to look up all the different rates for me...if he has the time ;)

As for lack of articulation it will depend on how much weight you have or plan to add to your front end. But, in general, just adding heavier coils for more lift will stiffen up the ride and lessen the articulation. A taller coil of the same rate will give lift but not harm articulation that much.
 

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Discussion Starter #8
Hytenor - thanks for the info & for jumping in on the other board. So we have reported better ride/better compression and droop over on Yota, whereas over here it looks like stiffer ride/less articulation from several different samples. Hmm...I guess most of the reported ride quality opinions over there are on 4Runners, so maybe this works well for them, but somehow due to the Taco's lighter weight its too stiff for us. This still bothers me because the weight difference isn't THAT significant is it?

Lavaboy2 - That's pretty funny, want a drink? ;P Here - use my 20hp throttlebody spacer as a coaster...cause that's all its good for...oh wait it makes annoying whistling sounds too....
 

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JonnyOzero3 said:
the weight difference isn't THAT significant is it?
and that's the big question. I know the weight difference between the 2.7 and the 3.4 is around 100#, so not much but that is just for the engine.
But, I have no idea about the difference between the different runner configurations (v6,v8, 2.7 2x,4x, etc.)

I guess we could look up the different GVW figures on differently equiped rigs but knowing how inaccurate Toyota's website is in that area I wouldn't know where to start compiling a list.
 

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Discussion Starter #10 (Edited)
jonnyozero3 running his mouth blah blah blah

hytenor said:
check the thread on Yotatech...all 17 pgs, LOL some very interesting stuff.

As for lack of articulation it will depend on how much weight you have or plan to add to your front end. But, in general, just adding heavier coils for more lift will stiffen up the ride and lessen the articulation. A taller coil of the same rate will give lift but not harm articulation that much.
Now you're speaking my language. A taller coil is what I am looking for. I don't have anything heavy on my front end - heaviest thing I am carrying is 90lbs of sliders. And I have no plans for a winch or a front bumper (not for years). Since my OME 881s are not really lifting me much (looks like 1" these days..Colorado and Moab did their toll on them), maybe I will move up to 882s or use trimpackers (which will change the ride quality, maybe minimally...correct?).

Side note: It's still interesting that those guys have used various combinations of stock coils, spacers, tundra coils, downeys, OMEs & SAWs and to sum up their opinion:

Overall, this front/rear setup (Tundra TRD 4WD Front Coils) KILLS all of them in ride comfort and flex ability
Hmmmmmm - does this mean the above products don't give as much flex as they do on tacomas? Am I wrong to assume that such aftermarket products on Tacomas increase flex ability? That would be silly given how similar the two vehicles are. I guess I am unsure how each different coil type ranks compared to one another in ride stiffness on the road, and flex ability up and down offroad....yeah I have some serious holes in my knowledge here.

I am finding my OMEs a bit stiff these days, but maybe I am paying more attention to the Downey AAL/N85s in the back and am incorrectly sharing the blame of the ride problem with the front end, :confused:

Okay time to find that original thread they mentioned...
 

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Discussion Starter #12
hytenor said:
I guess we could look up the different GVW figures on differently equiped rigs but knowing how inaccurate Toyota's website is in that area I wouldn't know where to start compiling a list.
Hmmm...this is getting messy! :explode: I think I found some curb weights on Edmunds..is that what we're looking for? The GVW all seem the same...
 

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Discussion Starter #13 (Edited)
vrooom

lavaboy2 said:
thats it! finally a good use for a throttle body spacer. if you can live without the extra 20 HP lol :rolleyes:
haha. I am ashamed I ever bought one. But I was a naive tacoma newbie itching to try new things. Hey, I got it for half price used. Not too bad right? lol.
 

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JonnyOzero3 said:
Now you're speaking my language. A taller coil is what I am looking for. I don't have anything heavy on my front end - heaviest thing I am carrying is 90lbs of sliders. And I have no plans for a winch or a front bumper (not for years). Since my OME 881s are not really lifting me much (looks like 1" these days..Colorado and Moab did their toll on them), maybe I will move up to 882s or use trimpackers (which will change the ride quality, maybe minimally...correct?).

Side note: It's still interesting that those guys have used various combinations of stock coils, spacers, tundra coils, downeys, OMEs & SAWs and to sum up their opinion:



Hmmmmmm - does this mean the above products don't give as much flex as they do on tacomas? Am I wrong to assume that such aftermarket products on Tacomas increase flex ability? That would be silly given how similar the two vehicles are. I guess I am unsure how each different coil type ranks compared to one another in ride stiffness on the road, and flex ability up and down offroad....yeah I have some serious holes in my knowledge here.

I am finding my OMEs a bit stiff these days, but maybe I am paying more attention to the Downey AAL/N85s in the back and am incorrectly sharing the blame of the ride problem with the front end, :confused:

Okay time to find that original thread they mentioned...
what truck do you have? excab, Dcab? what engine? TRD?
with only 1" out of 881s I'm guessing v6 Dcab.

the sliders shouldn't make any difference at only 90#. I have heard of some guys with crappy suspension adding heavy duty sliders (well over 100#) having issues at high speeds, though ;)

your N85s should dampen the AAL just fine as they are intended for use with OMEs 2" 7-leaf spring pks. but yes, that setup or any other for that matter, will ride rougher in general. Or...the N85s are actually TOO stiff for your rig. My first longer rear shocks were KYBs along with NWOR hd leafpks and the ride was terrible. I switched to Bilstein 5150s with the lighter valving (suggestion of the guy from Camburg.com) and ride improvement was incredible. So, that might be the problem with yours as well. The nwor springs are very stiff and I would have thought a stiffer shock would be best but it didn't work out that way...go figure.

my take on their opinion is that their flex increased with the tundra setup
 

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JonnyOzero3 said:
Hmmm...this is getting messy! :explode: I think I found some curb weights on Edmunds..is that what we're looking for? The GVW all seem the same...
good idea, I forgot about Edmunds; yea, same thing, curb weight. That will give us a starting point.
 

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Discussion Starter #16
Sorry - the truck was in my sig so I didn't specifcy. I have a 4wd '99 Xcab V6 TRD - only other weight considerations besides sliders are a tonneau cover(80lbs) and some junk in the back...~100lbs or so I'd guess.

I think my OMEs are at around 1-1.5" over stock right now, BUT I lost my old measurements to compare. I do know that when I originally did the lift almost 2 years ago I think the difference I measured was something like +1.75" of lift in the front. I think I measured from the floor to the top of the fender, which I think I have read isn't the correct method.

I have been drooling over the Bil 5150s...they look sweet. I was thinking those with a shock relocation (not sure of the tradeoffs for that yet) and maybe ditching the downey AAL for either Deaver 3-Leaf AALs or a more expensive full pack of OMEs, Deavers, etc. Groan :)

Edmunds may not help us....give me one moment to post what I found.
 

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Discussion Starter #17
according to edmunds.com

Curb Weights according to Edmunds.com

1999 4Runner (GVW 5250)
2.7L STD 2wd - 3440lbs​
2.7L STD 4wd - 3770​
3.4L SR5 2wd - 3600​
3.4L SR5 4wd - 3885​
3.4L Limited 2wd - 3710​
3.4L Limited 4wd - 3930​

(this is where things get a little funky)
1999 Tacoma Extracab (GVW 5140)
2.4L Base 2wd - 3175lbs​
2.7L Base 4wd - 3175​
2.7L Prerunner - 3175​
3.4L Prerunner - 3280​
2.4L SR5 2wd - 3280​
2.7L SR5 4wd - 3280​
3.4L SR5 2wd - 3280​
3.4L SR5 4wd - 3280​
3.4L Limited 4wd - 3280​
2.4/2.7/Pre/4wd/2wd Regcabs - 3035​

Is it just me or do some of the tacoma numbers just not make sense?
(off to bed for me...until tomorrow...good talking with you)
 

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JonnyOzero3 said:
Sorry - the truck was in my sig so I didn't specifcy. I have a 4wd '99 Xcab V6 TRD - only other weight considerations besides sliders are a tonneau cover(80lbs) and some junk in the back...~100lbs or so I'd guess.

I think my OMEs are at around 1-1.5" over stock right now, BUT I lost my old measurements to compare. I do know that when I originally did the lift almost 2 years ago I think the difference I measured was something like +1.75" of lift in the front. I think I measured from the floor to the top of the fender, which I think I have read isn't the correct method.

I have been drooling over the Bil 5150s...they look sweet. I was thinking those with a shock relocation (not sure of the tradeoffs for that yet) and maybe ditching the downey AAL for either Deaver 3-Leaf AALs or a more expensive full pack of OMEs, Deavers, etc. Groan :)

Edmunds may not help us....give me one moment to post what I found.
Ok, with the v6 excab the 881s are rated for 1.5" (from ARB) so that's about right. 882s would give you about 1" more or 2.5" or so after settling. You can just add about 1/2" worth of trim pks (3) to your 881s for the same lift. Opinions on ride quality are mixed from doing this; some say no difference, some say they got a stiffer ride. This would be the cheapest way to experiment. Ideally you should switch to adjustable coilovers but they ain't cheap ;)

Unfortunately Bilstein hasn't seen fit to make the 5150s in 1" incriments OR in the lighter valving in all lengths. If you are doing the relocate mod, however this won't be an issue.

Deaver makes great springs for flex but not so great for load capacity. Their 1.5 standard pks are actually softer than OE springs. The 7-leafs seem to handle the weight better, though. Alcans seem to be the spring of choice for heavy hauling. My nwors are great for hauling 2000# but aren't so great for flex.

in this crazy mod biz all it really takes is $$$
 

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JonnyOzero3 said:
Basically it involves using stock 4wd Tundra TRD coils ($120-$220) with either Tundra 2WD Red TRD Bilstein or Old Man Emu N91S struts, and small topout spacers to lift the front end. Looks very intriguing to me: seems like the YotaTech Tacos ended up with 2.25" of lift. The consensus on that board from the 4runner guys is that it rides very well.

Summary: http://fastq.com/~sschaefer/Tundra_Coils.html

Link: http://www.yotatech.com/showthread.php?t=41848&page=1

This seems like a very interesting and AFFORDABLE option....I am surprised I can't find any reference to it on here or the old board....

(is it possible to edit thread names? I wanted to make it more interesting so people would read it...oh well..)

For that money buy OME. It will perform better than stock and while it is not as good as $950 Donahoes, you get what you pay for.
 

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I think the ride quality is only a matter of opinion. I have the full OME set up on my dcab and love the ride, load capacity and handling. Others could say the ride is too stiff, don't need or want the load capacity and think the handling is less than satisfactory.

I say go for the Tundra coils because when you put the custom front bumper on with the WARN 9000 winch, you will appreciate the strength of support given. Not much worse than having the equipment installed on a gushie suspension that sags.

I've been missing your posts there OTaco...good to see you back on the boards!
 
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