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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
*Takes a deep breath*

Prepare yourself, it's a long writeup. But a lot of good information, even if you guys don't feel like ponying up for an intake.

Where do I start? It all started when I installed a scangauge II. I was shocked to see my intake temps so high. I didn't think much of it till' I towed with the Taco. Here's what really hit me, 50 degrees intake temperature rise!

So I decided to plug up the deckplate with the cover. I got better gas mileage, and I couldn't feel a power difference. I would like to have the power to tow, so adding a intake would be a good idea, and it would cut my Intake temperatures down.

For the sake of the forum, and testing purposes, I cleaned the MAF, and TB, and then removed the elbow from the airbox and slipped it back in. Reset the ECU.

Here are the defintions from the data:
** Denotes any time on the freeway
Ambient Temp: Temp outside
Starting Temp: When I first start the truck
Ending Temp: Right before I turn off the truck
Mileage: Warmup not included in mileage. Tracked with SG.
Comments: Any added comments. Locations included here. Also included, time the truck was not running priot to starting.

Note the "Freeway at 65MPH" means the cruise was set at the SAME exact spot, and the SG was used to get a average reading for approx .25 of a mile. It's a very slight incline, so that's why the MPG reading is low.

When I leave my hosue it is downhill to town. You will notice that anything from home to whereever will ahve better mileage than whereever to home.

Each test was done this way. It was ran for 2 days each. Here is the information I gathered:



Deckplate Plugged (Stock Box w/elbow removed)

Friday, 8:10 PM
Ambient Temperature: 53 Degrees
Starting Temperature: 57 Degrees, went straight to 55.
Ending Temperature: 57 Degrees
Mileage: 20.4 MPG/ 2.4 Miles
Comments: Home -> Gym. Truck was started cold.

Friday, 9:03 PM
Ambient Temp: 53 Degrees
Starting Temp: 73 Degrees
Ending Temp: 58 Degrees
Mileage: 19 MPG/ 2.1 Miles
Comments: Warm start, sat for 45 mins. Gym -> G/F's house.

Friday, 10:52 PM
Ambient Temp: 52 Degrees
Starting Temp: 71 Degrees
Ending Temp: 57 Degrees
Mileage: 13.7 MPG/ 3.4 Miles
Comments: Sat for 45 mins. From g/f to home
* Note that when driving home, I came accross a accident. I stopped and checked the passengers till PD showed up. Truck ran, decreasing MPG.

Saturday, 5:30 PM
Ambient Temp: 60 Degrees
Starting Temp: 62 Degrees
Ending Temp: 62 Degrees.
Mileage: 21.1 MPG/ 4.0 Miles
Comments: Truck was cold, from Home -> Ace Hardware.

Saturday, 5:51 PM
Ambient Temp: 60 Degrees
Starting Temp: 67 Degrees
Ending Temp: 66 Degrees
Mileage: 17.5 MPG/ .3 Miles
Comments: Stopped for 10 minutes, from Ace -> Kragen

Saturday, 6:02 PM **
Ambient Temp: 60 Degrees
Starting Temp: 76 Degrees
Ending Temp: 66 Degrees
Mileage: 20.6 MPG/ 14 Miles
Comments: Sat for 7 mins, from Kragen, to my work, to Vatozone (in one shot)

Saturday, 6:37 PM
Ambient Temp: 58 Degrees
Starting Temp: 83 Degrees
Ending Temp: 60 Degrees
Mileage: 16.3 MPG/ 4.7 Miles
Comments: Sat for 10 mins, from Vatozone -> Home

Saturday, 9:11 PM
Ambient Temp: 53 Degrees
Starting Temp: 72 Degrees
Ending Temp: 58 Degrees
Mileage: 22.8 MPG/ 3.3 Miles
Comments: Coolant already at 101 Degrees, from Home -> GF. Temps shot down quick after startup.

Saturday, 9:29 PM **
Ambient Temp: 53 Degrees
Starting Temp: 69 Degrees
Ending Temp: 58 Degrees
Mileage: 19.6 MPG/ 12.5 Miles
Comments: Sat for 9 mins, GF's -> Movies

Saturday, 11:41 PM **
Ambient Temp: 51 Degrees
Starting Temp: 80 Degrees
Ending Temp: 62 Degrees
Mileage: 17.5 MPG/ 12.3 Miles
Comments: 123 WT, Movies -> G/F's

Sunday, 12:27 AM
Ambient Temp: 50 Degrees
Starting Temp: 91 Degrees
Ending Temp: 57 Degrees
Mileage: 15.4 MPG/ 3.4 Miles
Comments: Sat for 10 mins, G/F's -> Home

On Freeway at 65MPH: 15.4 MPG


Deckplate open (With Elbow Removed)

Sunday, 10:40 AM (Happy Easter!)
Ambient Temp: 58 Degrees
Starting Temp: 58 Degrees
Ending Temp: 64 Degrees
Mileage: 21.5 MPG/ 3.3 Miles
Comments: Cold Start, Home -> Gf's

Sunday, 4:55 PM
Ambient Temp: 59 Degrees
Starting Temp: 74 Degrees
Ending Temp: 65 Degrees
Mileage: 14 MPG/ 1.2 Miles
Comments: Cold Start, G/F's to Buddies house, (right off the road)

Sunday, 5:12 PM
Ambient Temp: 59 Degrees
Starting Temp: 78 Degrees
Ending Temp: 76 Degrees
Mileage: 12.8 MPG/ 2.2 Miles
Comments: Sat for 7 mins, Buddies house to Home.

Monday, 1:13 PM
Ambient Temp: 64 Degrees
Starting Temp: 71 Degrees
Ending Temp: 69 Degrees
Mileage: 19.5 MPG/ 2.4 Miles
Comments: Colt start, Home to Gym.

Monday, 2:08 PM
Ambient Temp: 64 Degrees
Starting Temp: 94 Degrees
Ending Temp: 76 Degrees
Mileage: 13.2 MPG/ 2.5 Miles

Monday, 5:07 PM
Ambient Temp: 63 Degrees
Starting Temp: 83 Degrees
Ending Temp: 71 Degrees
Mileage: 21 MPG/ 1.9 Miles (Had to drive back home, forgot somethin along the way)
Comments: WT only at 105, Home to Buddies house.

Monday, 5:37 PM **
Ambient Temp: 62 Degrees
Starting Temp: 85 Degrees
Ending Temp: 76 Degrees
Mileage: 19.3 MPG/ 26.1 Miles
Comments: Sat for 10 mins, from Buddies to go on Duty in Fremont
*Note that temps while on freeway were 68 Degrees

Monday, 8:27 PM
Ambient Temp: 54 Degrees
Starting Temp: 64 Degrees
Ending Temp: 60 Degrees
Mileage: 14.7 MPG/ 2.9 Miles
Comments: From one station to another, cold start.

Monday, 9:00 PM **
Ambient Temp: 53 Degrees
Starting Temp: 87 Degrees
Ending Temp: 77 Degrees
Mileage: 16.8 MPG/ 4 Miles
Comments: Sat for 20 mins, One station to another station.

Monday, 9:35 PM **
Ambient Temp: 51 Degrees
Starting Temp: 100 Degrees
Ending Temp: 66 Degrees
Mileage: 18.5 MPG/ 29.5 Miles
Comments: From Station to home, to buddies house, to g/f's house (In one trip)

Tuesday, 1:04 AM
Ambient Temp: 45 Degrees
Starting Temp: 78 degrees
Ending Temp: 57 Degrees
Mileage: 14.2 MPG/ 3.4 Miles
Comments: From G/F's house to home.

Freeway at 65 MPH: 14.9


Outlaw X Performance Intake (Not Sealed Well)

Tuesday, 11:00 AM
Ambient Temp: 61 Degrees
Starting Temp: 61 Degrees
Ending Temp: 63 Degrees
Mileage: 25.2 MPG/ 2.5 Miles
Comments: Cold Start, from Home to 76 to get some gas.

Tuesday, 11:07 AM
Ambient Temp: 61 Degrees
Starting Temp: 66 Degrees
Ending Temp: 71 Degrees
Mileage: 18.7 MPG/ 1.5 Miles
Comments: From Gas to G/F's, hit every friggin light.

Tuesday: 11:16 AM **
Ambient Temp 62 Degrees
Starting Temp: 81 Degrees
Ending Temp: 73 Degrees
Mileage: 20.5 MPG/ 22.6 Miles
Comments: Sat for a couple minutes, from G/f's to Livermore to get my graphics for bike.

Tuesday, 12:32 PM
Ambient Temp: 70 Degrees
Starting Temp: 116 Degrees :eek:
Ending Temp: 81 Degrees
Mileage: 19.2 MPG/ 1.8 Miles
Comments: Sat for Sat for 45 mins, From graphics place to Burrito place

Tuesday, 1:05 PM **
Ambient Temp: 71 Degrees
Starting Temp: 109 Degrees
Ending Temp: 82 Degrees
Mileage: 18.4 MPG/ 3.7 Miles
Comments: From Burrito place, to **** Depot. Sat for 20 mins.

Tuesday, 1:27 PM **
Ambient Temp: 71 Degrees
Starting Temp: 118 Degrees
Ending Temp: 82 Degrees
Mileage: 19.2 MPG/ 4.5 Miles
Comments: From the **** Depot, to pick up graphics. Sat for 13 Mins.

Tuesday, 2:02 PM **
Ambient Temp: 71 Degrees
Starting Temp: 98 Degrees
Ending Temp: 89 Degrees
Mileage: 20.6 MPG/ 22.1 Miles
Comments: From Graphics place to home, with the A/C on.

Freeway @ 65 MPH: 15.8 MPG



Outlaw X Performance Intake (Somewhat better sealed)

Tuesday, 4:30 PM
Ambient Temp: 64 Degrees
Starting Temp: 83 Degrees
Ending Temp: 75 Degrees
Mileage: 22.8 MPG/ 3.2 Miles
Comments: Warm Start, form Home to Bank

Tuesday, 4:36 PM
Ambient Temp: 64 Degrees
Starting Temp: 80 Degrees
Ending Temp: 78 Degrees
Mileage: 16.9 MPG/ .7 Miles
Comments: Sat for a minute, from Bank to G/F's house

Tuesday, 4:46 PM
Ambient Temp: 64 Degrees
Starting Temp: 91 Degrees
Ending Temp: 74 Degrees
Mileage: 16.4 MPG/ 3.4 Miles
Comments: From G/F's house to home. Only sat for 5 mins.

Tuesday, 9:56 PM
Ambient Temp: 55 Degrees
Starting Temp: 71 degrees
Ending Temp: 60 Degrees
Mileage: 22.9 MPG/ 3.3 Miles
Comments: Home to GF's house, started with 87 WT.

Tuesday, 10:12 PM
Ambient Temp: 55 Degrees
Starting Temp: 71 Degrees
Ending Temp: 61 Degrees
Mileage: 16 MPG/ 3.4 Miles
Comments: From G/f's to Home. Sat for 6 mins.




Wow, lotta data! But you can clearly see this:

Outlaw Intake Freeway mileage at 65: 15.8 MPG
Deckplate Plugged w/Elbow Mod @ 65: 15.4 MPG
Deckplate Open w/Elbow Mod @ 65: 14.9 MPG

Theory Proves, that more HP = More MPG. Outlaw has Dyno's on thier site that claim 10.4 HP, and 12.6 ft lb, which I feel is a comfortable gain. I could barely make it up my hill to get home in 4th at 40mpg. I can now with the Outlaw. With the deckplate, I notice no difference at all...

So with that Theory, we can claim that the Deckplate when not fully pinned, makes less HP as you can see in the worse MPG accross the board.

Here's my theory on why the DP mod makes less horsepower under normal driving conditions:
  • When not pinned, the air can be pulled from the stock location just fine
  • Hotter air = less power
Since the extra airflow isn't needed, it's just pulling in hotter air, resulting in a worse MPG and worse HP. Even when fully pinned for a while while towing, the 50 degree rise in IA temps had to do wonders for HP and torque! (It was only 52 out, IA were 102 Degrees :eek: :eek: :eek: )



Now, you may be wondering about the Quality of the Outlaw, and why there is "partly sealed" and "not sealed very well". Here is my :2cents: on the System.

Pros:
  • The transistion from the tube to the TB is very smooth.
  • The MAF is similar to stock, it is a smaller diameter than the rest of the tube.
  • The Diameter of the tubes isn't much, but the MAF Diameter is much bigger.
  • Much straighter tube, very smooth inside.
  • Cleans up the engine bay, more room to work.
  • NeverOil air filter is a dry filter. Washable.
Cons:
  • Had to move wires and washer tubes from the fender
  • Tube could be a bit longer
  • One bolt to mount box means 2 people to isntall (one to hold the bottom, one to tighten top)
  • Box doesn't even seal to fender!
  • Had to break off bolt for washer bottle to slip new bolt through
To get the box to seal, I had to buy some foam weatherstrip. It took two layers against the fender to get it to seal. It does seem to help a bit.

After talking to Outlaw, they are going to send me a longer coupling to the TB to help combat the longer tube issue, and they are sending me a thicker gasket to apply to the intake. I will report my findings once I recieve this.

Cheap airbox, but isn't cheap on quality. I got it on ebay from a authorized dealer for 229 bucks. Not bad at all!

Maybe it's just me, but the Deckplate isn't all it's lived up to be. If I didn't buy the intake, and didn't need the extra HP to tow, I'd jeep the stock airbox, remove the elbow and plug the deckplate. It's not worth the mpg loss (10k miles a year means about 300 bucks lost in gas!) nor is it worth the hp loss while towing (When you especially need it the most)

If you look at it this way, you get .5 to 1mpg better with the outlaw for 200 bucks. It will pay off for itself in a year or two.

Pictures of the intake system installed, and the problems I encountered:


Wires that Had to be moved


Bolt stickin through, nut broke off.


Box off the truck. That is the gasket that will be replaced.


Stock intake top, Outlaw bottom.


Notice the difference in the MAF openings


Outlaw box installed.


Back of box.


"Birds eye View"


Driver side lookin to pass side, note how the Filter itself is where it takes up the vibes and movement from the motor.


Wires moved, gasket marked out on fender.



Post up comments guys. Any questions feel free to ask.
 

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Shit belongs in a magazine ;)

Good writeup.
 

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I think you pulled all those numbers out of your ass, and made all this up!














































...Just kidding! - GREAT JOB! I've been looking forward to reading this. I would like to see the differences with the supercharger, though. Maybe I'll conduct my own similar experiment with my scanner. Deckplate open vs. deckplate closed under normal driving conditions - but there's no way I'm buying that Outlaw Intake.

Again - Good job, Nice write-up. Maybe Gadget will chime in on this soon.
 

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Discussion Starter · #4 ·
Yeah, Like I'd waste a hour or two out my my time!

Thanks. I'd like to see the difference. Maybe it would make a larger difference with the supercharger since it would benefit from the extra airflow. IMHO, the stock box has no problem pulling through the stock location under normal driving conditions.
 

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Yeah, Like I'd waste a hour or two out my my time!

Thanks. I'd like to see the difference. Maybe it would make a larger difference with the supercharger since it would benefit from the extra airflow. IMHO, the stock box has no problem pulling through the stock location under normal driving conditions.
I'll be doing a bit of commuting a few times a week for the next few months, I'll see if I can keep track of everything there and back. I need to rework my supra MAF intake though before I do anything. I did a quick check last week on a ~50 mile drive...and got about 2mpg WORSE with the deckplate open.
 

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Discussion Starter · #7 ·
I'll be doing a bit of commuting a few times a week for the next few months, I'll see if I can keep track of everything there and back. I need to rework my supra MAF intake though before I do anything. I did a quick check last week on a ~50 mile drive...and got about 2mpg WORSE with the deckplate open.
Wow. Did you reset the ECU in between???

I swear, this SG is a godsend :)
 

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Discussion Starter · #8 ·
just what i wanted to see! i think you about sealed the deal on my k&n replacement :cool: outlaw should pay you for that crap!
I'm tryin to work out with Outlaw the problems that I encountered.

I think they have it set though. We'll see when the brown truck shows up! I tell you what though, great customer service.
 

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How do you know exactly how much fuel is used? Filling a gas tank varies a lot, especially if you only drive 3 miles between fils and only 3 cups if that goes in. You can easily stop it a quart early without noticing a big diff over 10-12 gallons of fuel. You filled the tank that many times after only a few cups of fuel?

It looks like you went to a bit of effort, but I would think there is nothing more accurate than pull 50 miles a few times with one set-up highway only with cruise set going the same stretch at the same direction at a close to same temp.

The conditions just vary wayyyy too much for me to hold true. But nice write-up.
 
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Gotta love that Scangauge! With real time data that it gives you, you can discover all sorts of things.

I played with it on the way to and from the Grand Canyon last month. Was shocked to see the MPG drop when the AC went on! Never thought it was that much. At some point I plan to play with it and see what the best MPG is I can get, and other things that affect it.
 

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Discussion Starter · #11 · (Edited)
How do you know exactly how much fuel is used? Filling a gas tank varies a lot, especially if you only drive 3 miles between fils and only 3 cups if that goes in. You can easily stop it a quart early without noticing a big diff over 10-12 gallons of fuel. You filled the tank that many times after only a few cups of fuel?

It looks like you went to a bit of effort, but I would think there is nothing more accurate than pull 50 miles a few times with one set-up highway only with cruise set going the same stretch at the same direction at a close to same temp.

The conditions just vary wayyyy too much for me to hold true. But nice write-up.
There is a feature on the scangauge that it shows the current MPG and values for the Current trip, Yesterdays trip, and the tank's trip...

Used the current trip. When I get down to the stop sign at my house, I would hit reset and go. When I would get out of a parking lot, I would hit reset then go.

It's fairly accurate. I come to find that the MPG figures are usually only .01 off each tankful.

It calculates load, throttle posistion, mph, and gph to come up with a figure.

Even so, each time the SG was used. Each tankful, the SG calulates VERY close to the hand calculated value.
 

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Discussion Starter · #12 ·
Gotta love that Scangauge! With real time data that it gives you, you can discover all sorts of things.

I played with it on the way to and from the Grand Canyon last month. Was shocked to see the MPG drop when the AC went on! Never thought it was that much. At some point I plan to play with it and see what the best MPG is I can get, and other things that affect it.
Mine only goes down about .5 a mpg.

I found that by going about 67mph on my truck, I get the best mpg.

Also, check this out:

Set the cruise at 65. Flip through the diff gauges till you get to MPH. Mine was off by 3%.

It's wierd, the speedo shows the value different than the ODO, er... vice versa...

Either way, I set my SG at 3% difference for the 32's. The speedo matches the SG now, and it calculates the real mileage per tank.
 

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I'm going to bring my SG along one of these days and see what my AITs are while driving. I'll post just for info to chew on.....
 

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It's wierd, the speedo shows the value different than the ODO, er... vice versa...
Not wierd at all, if you're talking about the dashboard instruments!

The speedo is an electro-mechanical meter, with its own tolerances. The odo is a pulse counter, it is only subject to the tolerances up to the sensor (which admittedly are typically substantial on their own).

I would very much expect there to be a discrepancy between the speedo and the odo, its the nature of real-world devices!
 

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nice, i think i may have sold my K&N FOR 170 shipped, now to pick up one of these nifty lil buggers, id like to order a scan guage to see the diffrences between the k&n and the outlaw
 

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how accurate did you find the TTE and the DTE were?
 

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Nice write up man, very thorough and complete. I have looked at the scan gauges...looks like a nifty toy that I will probably pick up. So the DP mod is bad or ??? I was just getting ready to do it this weekend but may holdoff due to your write up.....
 

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Discussion Starter · #19 ·
Nice write up man, very thorough and complete. I have looked at the scan gauges...looks like a nifty toy that I will probably pick up. So the DP mod is bad or ??? I was just getting ready to do it this weekend but may holdoff due to your write up.....
Well, look at this way;

The Outlaw is said to provide more howsepower. Even though it is allowing more air, you are still getting better mpg. More hp = Better MPG.

The stock box makes about .5 to 1 mpg better than the deckplate mod. This is telling me that the deckplate mod creates less hp under normal driving conditions. Why? The extra airflor is no needed, it is just allowing much hotter air into the box.

Just do the elbow mod, call it a day.
 

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I took my truck up the pass today (to be sure that there was no doubt [in my mind] that it was being run hard) to watch the Air Intake Temps. The only time that mine went up was when I sat around and idled.

I obviously didn't do as thorough job as NorcalPR, nor am I going to try, but there are also some things about my truck that I'm sure gave me different results.

1. Supercharger
2. Supra MAF
3. Elbow Mod
  • Fiberglass fenders
  • No fender liners

I don't think I'd run one if it were free...:2cents:
 
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